Any updates?

Not too much, I've been away on a long vacation, just got back, and have family in town for my daughter's birthday. Not much time to do much with it.
Looks like the MMM XL will be out soon, so gonna have to get my azz in gear tho :)

I did get in the Mugen arms and carriers before I left and did some sizing up to get a rough idea if it can work. The bottom arms should be fairly easy to mount. Just a couple spacers will be needed. I will have to remove the material where the lower arm pins go thru on the FLM bulkhead. The arms will just be held by the braces truggy style, which should be fine. Making me a bit nervous to go hacking up the bulkhead just yet tho.

It did seem like I will gain about 8-10mm ea side over the XL width tho. That's w/ 0 offset hubs also. Offset hubs can push that to 20+mm. Its hard fought for a bit of width, but hopefully its worth it. I don't need to do anything that will ruin the bulkheads if I decide the mugen arms don't work out well and decide to go back to the Sav arms. If anything, str should be the same, but a little less weight and nowhere for pins to bend in and get stuck.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...7151309373.jpg

As I thought, the ugly bit will be to figure out the top arms. Here's a pic of the Sav adj arm mounted to with the mugen arm. The arm is way shorter. so I need either a long turnbuckle and some type of coulper to attach the pillowball, or find some way to use the Mugen upper arms. I'm worried this will be the weakpoint in the design. Got a couple ideas, but nothing great so far.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...7151746776.jpg

Also, the shock mounts will sit a bit more forward, so I can use the LST shocks easy enough if I want to keep them, or have plenty of room for other shocks depending on how I want to go. In the interest of $$$, I may use the LST shocks for now and worry about other options later if needed. They still look tthe coolest on there anyway, and do work well.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...7152100601.jpg


BTW: The pillowballs are M6 thread. One option may be to talk to FLM to see if they can make a extra extended version of their alu savage upper arms w/ a M6 thread. But, I've seen him request minimum orders on some types of custom work, so who knows if that would work. Sounds expensive anyway, want to stay away from alu arms, and would like something easily replacible if it breaks anyway.
I may just use a take a ballend from a 'uggy, remove the ball mount aprt, and just use the long tube end as a coupler between the M5 turnbuckle and the M6 pillowball intially just to get something working. May end up working well if I can find a section long enough to encase much of the turnbuckle.
I still have my 0.5" nylon rod on backorder. I could use that too if the plastic proves strong enough.

So I'd been debating just how to go on a couple things, so I decided I'd order the body now and see how it looks and decide from there. Got it in today, and all I can say is, Wow... this thing is fraking huge!

I cut the tvps to match the wheelbase, but what I didn't know was just how wide it was going to be. I like it from most angles, but a couple others I'm not hot on...

Pix:

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...8659857381.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...8659366731.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...8659321148.jpg

The last is the one I don't like. Could be that its just the narrow width and lack of a wing and the back not cut out. Gonna have to find a way to make a good roll cage too to protect it. As huge as the sav looks extended, this body managed to make it look small lol!

OTOH, I don't think I can shorten the tvps much as the body won't fit. 20" it is. Gotta get the width going to make it look right tho I think.

Here's a pic of an actual FG beetle. Looks like the ass end is just kinda big regardless.
What I did notice tho is that the inside of the tires on the FG are even with the edge of the body. They are tucked about an 1" in on the Sav. Hopefully getting the wider track and the body better mounted and painted will solve the dimension issues.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...e/p1020914.jpg

Been really busy, but what I aiming for now is getting another set of tvps cut with a few tweaks now I know the WB I want. I will focus on getting the TVPs done first. I did measure out what I need to cut out on the FLM bulkheads, and its going to be a bit of work, so that bit will come later. The truck will drive fine in the config it is now w/ the Sav arms, so no need to rush it.

awesome build bud! that is one huge truck!

I love the work for the arms!!! those truggy arms look weaker than the stock arms? what do you think???
Im was going to give this a go, and you are definitely doing the right thing, modding the bulk to fit the arm... but i dont think i would want to mod an alloy bulk!!! maybe a plastic one? From you pictures, it looks like you have the lower arm on the bulk fine already? how much has to be taken off the bulk?

The beetle body is HAAAUGE! something different! and should look sick when painted!

Truck def needs to be wider! so im looking forward how much more the arms widen it by!

gd job
Thanks

Dunno, the body looks ok to me as is.

The arms should be fine, I've had no problem with my truggy and its been bashed as hard or harder than my Savages. The only really issue might be that truggy arms, since they are built for racing, are made of stiffer material so may not flex as much on an impact.

They are def a very stiff plastic, and seem quite tough and thick. There is quite a bit more material around the pin, and that's where I always broke the savage arms.

So there may be a chance they will prove more fragile, but looking at them now I think the Mugen arms will prove stronger. I am trying to make it so I can undo it and put back on sav arms if needed. I know you can get very soft RPM arms that will never break, but I don't always like them as they bend so much handling gets a bit sloppy and other parts tend to bend with all the distorsion, particularly driveshafts.

I looked at doing it with the plastic bulkheads as a test, but the new two peice design would make it extremely weak around the diff bearings, and I don't really want to do that. There might be some ways around it by making new braces to push the pins out a bit or something, but I'm not feeling bothered to try.

I'll post a pic of where I marked off the bulkhead for modification. Its not too bad actually. The trick is where I want to keep the extra M4 hole on bottom that mounts the skidplate to the bulkhead. I don't think its critical, but I'm going to try and keep it since I will remove so much material on bottom. Can't put material back. ;)
If I decided to ditch it, the bulk could just be modded with a hand file.Basically what you are doing is removing the block where the hinge pin passes thru. The arm will be entirely supported by the pin braces. This is a typical truggy setup. Doesn't do much good to have the pin passing thru material in the bulkhead at the center fo the pin. Just a place to get the pin stuck if an arm did break and bent a pin.
From the pic, you are basically wiping out the area on bottom where "fastlane" is written.

Otherwise If been doing a bit of finishing work to the bulkheads to remove some excess material where I can to slim it down a notch. Nothing radical, and just done by hand files.

@ Jahay, I could get a plastic one to test, but looked like it would be more difficult to do, plus I'd have to test it out on my one good set, or buy a new set, and really don't feel like spending the time or $$. :)

Don't have it mounted yet, just a photo trick for a mock-up. Width should be ~10mm ea side over the XL width (ie w/ ext axles.) That's with 0 offset hubs. I wanted to get extended hubs to push it out a bit more. It wouldn't be hard to get 20+mm (.75-1.0") ea side over the XL.


Maybe the body does look okay. It was just a bit shocking yesterday. Painted, trimmed and truck widened a bit and I think it will be great.

So I finally got a good chance to work on the bulkheads. Got them cut down and the first set of arms mounted. Fairly easy once I got everything setup. Decided to leave the center skid plate screw hole and notch the arms around it. No arm braces yet for it. Also made a coupler from nylon to mount the upper arms as well. A little bulky, but came out stronger than I expected. Pretty happy so far.

IDK if this is a final solution, but something to get it working for now. I can make it pretty later.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...9179038527.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...9179191054.jpg

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...9179084813.jpg

It looks really good. Have you tried the LST2 arms? they are wide and u can use the knuckle and CVDs. from what i've heard they are bullet proof.

I am trying to revolve what ever i do around the availablity, strength of the drive shafts...

I did hear that the LST2 shafts were strong (they are not as think as the SHD Savage shafts, but i think they are made of a better material?

What i didnt like is that the LST2 kunckles and hubs have very limited steering... Is there anyway of improving this???

Also LST2 arms are bascially the same length as savage arms...

Finn you did a nice job on the arms and bulks... could you take a picture of the modified area of the bulks without the arm attached so i can see how much you removed?

Jahay, I don't have LST2 but from what Ive read, the driveshafts has the same thickness as the SHD shafts, about 5mm thick.
As for the length of the arms, its kinda of weird though since LST2 is much wider than Savage.

I think the reason it looks much wider is because they run stupidly un necessarily PPPHHAAATTT wheels and tyres!!!

i put an LST CVD next to a SHD shaft... The SHD was maybe 1mm or so thicker.... BUT i think the stainless steel the LST CVD was made from, was stronger?

Anyway... i am quite tempted by going this route with LST Arms (try something different) but i hate the turning radius.

Here's a thread I started comparing arm sizes. The LSTs were not any bigger, but a shape that would be a pita to deal with and make work.

So, I do have some disappointing news to report.. When I did my original width extension measurements.. I had the carrier on upside down :drunk:

The carrier is offset top to bottom, so all of the increased width I was measuring was due to this. I only figured it out after I had the whole thing together and the droop was so bad. The pillow balls were bottoming out on the carrier as it wasn't designed to move that much in that direction. Doh!

So I flipped it around properly, and its actually the same exact width as the savage arms, going from outer bearing to outer bearing!

So all this work and I've just given myself different arms and a better potential steering setup, as well as proper 8mm axles. Oh wells. I always assumed this was a possibility, so I never did anything to the bulkheads that would preclude me from using the sav arms if I decided to go back.

I will go forward with it for now, and still get some hub extenders with proper 17mm wheel nuts. My width increase over the XL width is now looking like 5mm :yipi:. Least they are good ofna adapters, and not crappy integy adapters that strip easy.

The other issue I ran into was the arms for the rear. Specifically, being able to position the rear arm to get 0 caster and not block the shock mount. I was planning on just flipping the upper arm around in back, and the caster would be close to 0. However, that then mounts the arm right above the shock mount. There is no chock mount for the other side, and going out from the upper arm makes the upper shock mount way off the shock tower.

Ideal solution would be a curved upper arm, like a LST. Otherwise I could try to come up with some compromise with the tower, else ditch the rear steer and just mount a mbx6t rear arm with fixed hubs and go from there. Had been mulling this anyway, as I have enough sav parts to make two Savs now, and maybe I'll make one a 4ws monster truck style with my current arms and bulkheads, the other a 2ws speed demon beetle.

Looking at some of the TCS and other sav 5T conversions, the steering isn't that bad, and the truck would still shorter, with a CD, and the mugen steering setup. Basically. I don't think a truck with a 1520 on 8s would handle 4ws well anyway.

So I finally got the final shape of the tvps I was happy with and went ahead and cut the tvps. Everything turned out pretty good, and the fit was good.

Mounted my template on two plates of alu. Cut out around the template markings, then cut the bulkhead screw holes w/ the press. The actual cutting went pretty fast on the band saw.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...9685053492.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...9697258932.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...9685071132.jpg

Also ordered some more parts as the monthly rc budget turns over. Decided I was going to just install a fixed rear end for now. Got mugen rear arms and hubs coming, as well as all the cvds. I'm thinking the steering is going to be good enough for for 2ws. Its going to be a pita to figure out the 4ws with the top arms to get the caster right, as well as room for shocks. Plus there was no way to get the rear steering inside the tvps, as well as have room for batts and electronics. The rear arms are the same size as the fronts, so I can easily swap them later as I get it worked out if I want to.
The other plus is I can have more power and speed. 4ws gets a bit unstable with higher speeds as even a strong servo in the rear has trouble holding the rear str rack solid @ neutral at high speeds. 40mph or so is about the max with the old setup before it got a bit wily.

Couple more pix. Got the bulkheads attached as well as the str servo. Its purple, but will get stripped later. Just test fitting. Looks like the str is off a bit and will need different ball end mounts for proper clearance and to avoid bumpsteer

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...9768595314.jpg

If you notice on the left, I fit the Mugen captured hinge pins on the lower arm. Fits like it was meant to be there. Needed a little filing around the stock arm brace to clear the arm, but I will just make my own billet arm brace later once the shape is confirmed. Want to figure a way to capture the upper arm pins as well. Have an idea for later..

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...9768616961.jpg

That is huge!!!!

I can see now how much you had to file of the bulks to get the arms to FIT!!! quite a bit!!! but should be fine anyway...

keep me posted! :)

In all, I removed about 6g worth of material per bulk half. Fortunately most of the work was done by my drill press. I basically ran a bit just larger than the arms right down the hinge pin hole to open it up. It only took me a few minutes to do the entire set. Most of the work came after removing a few bits here and there to get the right fit and clean the bulks a bit. I have one more set I have to do the finishing work on. I'll get a pic soon to show.

Also sat and played with the front str rack and servo placement a bit doing some brainstorming. Had an idea where I could move the motor up farther, move the servo from where its shown, and have enough room in back where I might just have enough room for a rear str setup.

I think I'll go ahead with the fixed rear for now, but leave room for a rear str setup I can swap in later. The front and rear arms are interchangeable, so just an arm and hub swap and a couple other bits would be needed to change the rear over for 4ws. I might be able to work it out so its a quick swap. We'll see.

Here's a pic of one of the bulkheads off the drill press, but not yet finished. I ran the drill down the hinge pin hole, and used it to remove a bit from the remaining outside. I still need to remove the rest of that material (by dremel and by hand) as well as do a bit of shaping on the inside to give the arms full range of movement. You can see I left the center section in place.
Its pretty shiny, so the contrast is a bit tough to see. :)

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...9912122238.jpg

Did the finishing work on this bulkhead before I went to bed last night.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...9998391151.jpg

Turns out well, but a mill would be so much easier and cleaner :)
Plus the bit doesn't skip across your work. Dremel jumped a couple times and nicked the work. Nothing bad, but will have to work it out on the polishing step.

thanks for the pictures. Gives me a good idea as to how much must come off...

Im looking at trying to adapt some losi arms at the moment... ill keep you posted on how it goes...

I REALLY WANT A MILL!!! Would make these jobs quicker & Easier!

So a bit of playing around with the cad program from emachineshop. Drew up a simple shock tower that I'm going to test cut on the pegboard tomorrow.
2nd time playing with it, and had an easier time of doing things and figuring out how to make more complicated shapes by using a few tricks in the proggy. Happier with how it ended than where I started!

Was going to cut this from 1/4" 7075 I have. Considering picking up some CF instead. I found some ~cheap CF in small sizes. Enough to make the tower.

I can refine it later some more, but should be good for a test cut.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...hocktowers.jpg

This is designed for flux shocks which I received yesterday. The LSTs are just too big to mount how id like, and there the shafts snapped alot anyway. The fluxes look good and much lighter.

Also recieved my mbx6t rear suspension set yesterday also, as well as all the axles.

First off, the axles do look slightly longer than the XLs. :yipi: Nice 8mm shaft that should hold the hex extenders too. Will get more width than I was thinking.
Planning to get +15mm ofna adapters. Should push it out nicely.

The other good thing is that the weight is half of the XL axles. 25g vs 50g for the above setup. Thats 100g savings total alone. The axles seem strong, and the cvds spin smoothly. Hopefully they last.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...0228681724.jpg


The other interesting thing was that the toe plates that came with the suspension set fit the Sav bulks actually quite closely. Some simple mods and they will fit right in. The other bonus is that they came with a bunch of toe plates, all for different toe and anti-squat settings. It would be awesome if I could get these to work!

I overlaid the Sav hinge pin brace over the brace from the mugen. Very close screw mounting. Need to open the holes on the mugen from 3mm to 4mm anyway, should be easy to make it fit. :)

Crappy pic, but I put M3 screws thru the mugen brace, and up thru the HPI on top.
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...0228994468.jpg

Off-topic...
 

And now for something completely random:

Was playing play-doh w/ my son. Army men vs Ogre.

Ogre won lol

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...9751963524.jpg

Looks like it is a beast.
I like big trucks.
Can't wait to see how it all turns out in the end.

Thanks CHC, I like how its going, but be a while before Im done.

Got the first test tower cut. Came out well IMO, but I'll thicken a couple of areas. I think I have the bolt alignments spot on.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...0277791740.jpg

This was designed for a flux length shock. It would be easy to just use BB truggy shocks and cut a shorter tower. Actually might be preferable, less leverage for the tower to get bent back. For this project tho, I'm going with the long shocks

Moar
 

Also made up a template for a rear tower. One of the challenges was to mount the wing when the body is so freaking tall. Was going to use some of the roll bar nylon, but was not too thrilled w/ that. Would be a pain to get straight for starters.

Decided on using a mugen wing mount, and mount it high on the towers. Will probably have to figure out a brace for the tower, but thats not a bad thing anyway.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...towersrear.jpg

Made from F tower design. Tweaked some things too.

Mounted:

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...0318166499.jpg

With body in place. Looks about right. Marvel at my awesome body prop/ shop rags lol.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...0318014072.jpg

Been a while since the last update, but I've been making some progress as time and budget allows.

I got some hub extenders to finish off the arm assembly. I got some +15mm, as well as +30mm hexes. The +30's really push the wheels out, and are mounted in the pix below. To make the ofna hubs work on the mugen axles, I had to file down the inside flanges (where the hub meets the wheel bearing) down from .5mm to .2mm. Even then I had to use 2.3mm pins instead of the std 2.5mm pins. At this point I'm not going to worry about a small loss in str. I can trim down the hub a bit more to fit a bigger thru pin, but I would have to trim back the whole hub, not just the bearing flange.

The width looks good now. I'm not really going to worry about too much extra bearing wear, as the stock mugen hubs look about +15mm anyway, and the bearings are only $1ea from Avid.

Don't mind the front toe out. I know its way off, but don't care for now. don't mind my son's Thomas track either lol.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...2715629225.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...2715610683.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...2715690413.jpg


I also fit the Mugen arm braces to the Savage bulkhead in the rear. Is allows me to use different toe plates to adjust toe and anti-squat. Cool. I did have to completely remove the remaining material in the bulkhead that was for holding the hingepins. Now the pins will be completely held by arm braces ala truggy style. I will have to mod the arm braces slightly, as well as the Sav skid plate to make everything fit.

The original holes are for 3mm screws, the Sav uses 4mm. The screw hole alignment between the Sav bulk and the mugen brace are only off by ~.2mm. Easy enough to adjust for when widening out the mounting holes.

I want to recess the front arm brace (made from 5mm 7075) onto the two 4mm screw posts on the flm bulkhead. (seen in the previous pix, underneath the drive pinion.) The posts are 7.1mm tho, and I need to get a drill bit that is close.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...2715821468.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...2715671441.jpg

I also started cutting the shock towers from 0.25" 7075 alu. Holy @#$% that material is tough. My saw would zip right thru 0.25" 6061, but it cut very slowly thru the 7075. Got all the way around the outer template, then my band saw threw the tire. Eh, I was waiting to replace it anyway, but sucked it did it right there. Otherwise I'm happy how the tower came out. I tweaked the design a bit from last time, and added body mount holes to use either the Mugen body mounts I have, or directly bolt Revo body mounts to the tower. The Revo mounts have always been very tough, so I'll likely go with those, plus I have lots of spares. The oem savage body mounts always broke on me.

Not too much work to be done until after Xmas. Need to repair the saw as a top priority.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y25...2725842638.jpg

very cool project. I love the large sale and FG beetle body. Kinda suprised the Mashers don't look too small for it.

Is there any update yet???

how did you find the arm conversion? was it strong enough?

I haven't done anything with this since the last post, nor any other RC. I have just been too busy with Xmas, holiday travel, work/kids/storms in Jan. and a continuation of it until now.

I need to get some more materials and tools to move on, but I've been spending all my play money buying Legos to go along with the Lego train set I got my son for Xmas.

LOL, I might bring home a set I got, or parts ordered online and my wife kinda complained/ asked about the money I spent on it. Ha, wanted to tell her it was cheap compared to the RC stuff! Best off that I didn't say anything other than to ask her if I should take up another hobby such as motorcycles, jet skis or horses. Pretty much ended that conversation. :)

I hope to get it done by spring time/May or so. Wish it was sooner, but just aint gonna happen. :)

thats all good!!!
just keep us posted on how things pan out