The mirrored mount strategy wouldn't work with this Losi(any of them, really) - the center diff is quite a ways off center, which angles the front-center drive shaft quite a bit and would severely limit gearing possibilities. The ESC placement was for left/right weight balance. The diff, motor, steering servo and radio box are all right-side-mounted, so the battery tray, esc and batteries in their current location created a near-perfect balance using a pair of 5400 4s Hyperion packs as a baseline(figured most would opt for 8s and at least 5kmah capacity). The V2 tray should be done tomorrow, which is just slightly longer and wider to accomodate a wider variety of pack combinations. I may do a few "other" layouts as well - the HK 8000mah packs are huge, so a strategy that allows a pair laid down with the ESC directly behind the center diff may be an option.

I have seen the other 2 options - don't think either is as well thought out or balanced as my kit(my biased opinion of course) and both are likely much more expensive(the one Kershaw is offering is 2x the price). :)

Yes your kit is cheaper,and better, but how would I Run 14s in theory?and I was thinking about wiring? do you think saddle would be any good?if it could be achieved,

14s
 

First, you would need a 14s ESC and a 14s motor capable of powering the truck. A pair of 7s packs(Hyperion, for example) will fit the battery tray, though you would need longer straps. I don't see how you would need more wiring or wiring difficulty - the motor and esc and batteries are all near each other on the chassis and a pair of 7s packs wires up the same as a pair of 4s packs. The theoretical 14s setup will create the same challenge on any configuration not designed for your specific(theoretical) setup - nothing is really "one size fits all", but we try for "one size fits most". :)

And balls of steel to plug the batteries in :)

14s would be more of an arc than a spark...

Mike: I agree rotating the current mount and cd wouldn't work bc of the front shaft and the lack of space in front of the cd. But a mirror image of your mount (not rotated at all) would put the motor in the center of the chassis (behind the cd, not in front) and I can't see why that wouldn't work?? With saddle packs that might have better balance for a wider variety of setups. That was my point and just discussing.

Personally I prefer your more simple design and knowing your other products I don't doubt your research into the balance of the current setup. Didn't see anything about when it will be available??

if u talk to guys that have been using high voltage in their planes I think u will come to the conclusion that 8s is by far the best bang for the buck and more is unnessary.blipping the throttle with 50 volts floating around is not for the guy on a fixed salary

I have all the above electrics:smile:

14s do weigh heavier, thats why i was asking about saddle aswell

Jon

very big indeed,my lipos did touch oneday whoosh:gasp:

Really am looking forward to seeing this up and running,dont forget post up your stuff on Baja UK forum:yes:

Yes, this concept would indeed work(considered it), but would also ultimately result in the mass being located over a wider area(not as centered on the chassis), as balance would pretty much dictate the packs be out on the mud guards(higher Cg as well). With the mass more spread out(and more mass due to extra batt tray and esc mount), the car would be less likely to traction roll(though mass would be higher, which may offset this benefit), but would tend to be slower in its transitional handling(switching directions) - two battery trays would then be needed as well as a new home for the ESC. Ultimately, I think the current setup offers the most positives and the least negatives. It certainly isn't the only way to convert the truck - just the way I chose to do it. They should be on the home page by the weekend. :)

tempted to get a losi for this reason only.

Then it isn't a theory now, is it? Does the ESC have car firmware and brakes? If not, you would need another servo, servo mount, etc. as well. Without good car firmware, startup leaves a bit to be desired as well. The mount is only one hole away from accepting mechanical brakes, and the stock brake disc will work with the 2028 motor and an 18t pinion or larger(could also trim the disc to allow smaller pinions). The setup shown here is ideal and will work for most without any additonal complexities. For your 14s setup, you may need to do something differently - I guess you maybe already knew that, though(14s in itself is out of the ordinary - I have a 1:1 electric dirt bike that runs on 14s so maybe it is a little overkill for this car?!). :)

Looking at it again, I see your point about the trays being on the mudguards, something I didn't like about one of the other kits. Thought there was room on the chassis for them but there isn't. Thanks for discussing and clearing things up.

johnny nitro! get one.u wont regret it.

I know very tempted,Very but I have a Nue 22 series will it fit the Losi Mount,I know is other conversion did, has had bought it.

I know its off topic but looking back at the data log it looks like that thing is pushing 8 hp! Is that correct? If so thats a ridiculous power to weight ratio, something you cant get in the full scale world.

yup:-)

i got more video sunday.
and i got to do a serious test at the track today.
i got 12 minutes run time at the track with out any stopping. 75 degrees out .motor was 200 degrees ( no fan) esc was 120F
150 amp current limiter . lipo cutoff was 3.4
17 T pinion ( way faster than a 200 foot straight could handle. tires never stopped spinning.

jumps are a 1/4 throttle blip .any more and i have to fetch it from the corn field. actually is drove itself back from the corn lol





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and to compare it to a stock gas truck'
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and another just bashing
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<a href="http://s7.photobucket.com/albums/y293/autoauto2/?action=view&amp;current=losi5ivesliding.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y293/autoauto2/losi5ivesliding.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

yes 8 HP and that is traction limited. and had a 200 amp current limiter at that time.

I wonder how much temps would drop using a separate brake servo? I know that was something that MCD at least felt dropped the temps on there planned conversion.

:intello: :gasp: :oh: :surprised: :D :D awesome!

200f is too hot, something's not right there.

im only braking once or twice a lap. just a touch to slow it after the straight and in the middle.i could do a test an do no braking and see if temps go down.
its still overgeared for this track. would like to try a 16 pinion.

Definitely worth a shot to try the gearing first and see how it goes. Hopefully it works out for you.

My thoughts exactly, something's definitely not right much longer at 200f.. demagnetizing effect would ruin one's day I think..

Wow, thats a huge difference! You could almost make that triple into a quintuple if it weren't for the fact you couldn't slow down enough for the next turn! I see what you mean about the stocker not being able to turn enough though. Gotta love brushless, always enough power on tap to do whatever you want!

i did make a quintuple plus a few feet and ended up in the next lane. if you play with it in the air you can get it to slow down and just land for the rt turn. i made it once out of 3 and decided to just do a quad lol

i changed the current limiter from 200 to 150 just before that run. could that cause the motor to heat up?how?

It's diffing out to the front a lot. From my experience with brushless motors, this is just my experience, brushless motors like a load. Diffing out may be causing the motor to run with less of a load causing slight over revving. I fixed this same sort of issue in my 1/8th Truggy by going to a thicker center diff oil.

In my baja the 2028 was running hot, so I went up two teeth on the pinion and it coooled down some.

Again this is just from my experience, I'm by no means saying that's the problem with your truck or saying I'm an expert at this...end disclaimer.

Not exactly sure and there could be a few causes to reason.. FG101C may be on the right track regarding the center diff in general.

I've stated elsewhere about the heat generated through the use of a center diff that unloads quite often on my heavy vehicles. Mike countered that the sharp angles of the drive shafts are the reason for excessive heat.

In either case (or perhaps both combined), the motor mount transfers that heat as well. I'm sure that would contribute to overall high motor temps.

Patrick from Castle can chime in on the efficiency curve of the 2028. In my XBE for example, a 1520 runs cooler with the relatively tall stock gearing (~50mph) than a 1717 does. Hard to fathom at first, but then CC released info that the 1717 seems to "brick wall" after certain rpm's in terms of efficiency.

Regardless of the cause, I go for the lowest temps possible and 200f is pushing it. Sometimes a little trial and error is in order to find where things seem most comfortable.

That's also why you should never test a brushless motor on your bench with no load!

i have 30000 dif oil in the center and its still diffing out lol
well this is interesting cause i though it would of run hotter on the street using a lot of brakes and basically dragracing over and over but it ran hotter on a dusty track with no real traction with a 17 pinion where i had an 18 on the street. i probablly didnt drive it for 12 minutes on the street though cause bashing gets boring to me real fast. plus it was 45-50 degrees during the street test and the track test was 70 degrees f

The motor looks tiny in that vehicle, guess if you have it geared wrong it will quickly damage the motor.

i never thought 30,000 would diff out like that.:-) well guys what do you-all suggest? 50,000 and gear it for 55MPH ? i used brians speed calculator and without ballooning tires the 17 i have in it is geared for like 46 mph + or- and i doubt im going that fast on the straight? mike is sending me a 16 t to try and if that doesnt help its back up to 18T oh and BTW the 18 pinion is SICK! FAST. but full throttle from a dead stop was worse with the 18. from a slight roll it lifted the ft tires for a sec.

"I've stated elsewhere about the heat generated through the use of a center diff that unloads quite often on my heavy vehicles. Mike countered that the sharp angles of the drive shafts are the reason for excessive heat. "

yes center diff front cup is 180 degrees. some of the gas guys that run for hours have actually got the dog bone blue from the heat. the rear cup was 150.

Diffing out def cause excessive heat, had the same probs with my EP buggys till the CD was running heavier fluids.
As if you hadn't heard it enough, 200* is excessive. With that much power to weight ratio you should be running 150-160* at the most. Gearing down may kill the fun a bit but def make a nicer/more managable drive and bring the heat way down.

My 2cents

bondo i do know 200 is hot. thanks:-) only happened once. wont happen again. kinda suprised me. i did gear down. from 18 to17. is 45ish MPH too high for a track with 200 foot straight? maybe. that why i ordered a 16 from mike. but a few other people thought i need to gear up to give the motor some load. i do have 30,000 in the center. guess im going to 50,000?

I am wondering with the 1/5, do the same rules apply as far as where you are topping out at down the longest straight when determining initial gearing.

Hopefully you can clear up the heat issue.

No traction, diff unloading - to me sounds like lots of wheel spinning - and heat generated in the motor from revving at high rpms w/o load. I would definitely go up in weight in the cd - many of us have used 100k in smaller trucks with success. What about punch control or torque limiting on the esc - have you tried those to see if they would make the truck more controllable (less wheel spin)?

is current limiter the same a torque control? if yes then i did. stock was at 200 amps. im at 150
I LIKE WHEEL SPIN lol.:-( i can drive with a lighter trigger finger and in a race i would but that doesnt show off how crazy this thing can be.

btw the truck is totally controlable :-) its the best sct ive ever driven no matter what the size. no matter how much wheel spin. its a beast.