toughest 1/18
 

Howdy.. I'm sick of my pathetic weak mini lst diff spider gears. Unless someone can make me some steel gears for the thing I want to get something more durable.. What are the other MT/ST minis out there like?

So far I only really know of the vendetta ST, mini quake, rc18mt (I would just get the factory team 18t and the MT wheels, thats the only real difference), or the trinity now, mini inferno st.

I like the inferno st with its hardened steel diff gear option, but getting parts is a hassle, a lot of sites I've seen them on say they're discontinued... not something I want to start to get into

Are any of these others able to take serious brushless power? I have got the the point where I really dont like team losi anymore, I'm sick of persisting with their absolutely sh!t customer service and poorly designed minis.

Well, I keep a small 1/18 offroad track in my backyard, have seen many small scale RC cars taking all kind of abuse there and I have to tell you that the AE RC18s are by far the toughest. They just keep going. Out of all my own RCs the RC18s require the least wrenching, and they get BY FAR the most wheel time (a track in the backyard can do this :wink: )

Just get the MIP super diffs and their CVDs and yo should be set. If you drive mad overkill brushless setups the diffs like to go from time to time, but that's nothing like the Losis. On my own RC18 the diffs last a couple months, with almost everyday driving in summer.

Just now, after 2 years, we see some servos going bad. But most have heavily modified (or even glued) servo safers.

Another thing I'd suggest is the Driven Productions gearcover, and their draglink. The gearcover is a must for offroad. And the drag link is a must anyway.

Those 4 mentioned upgrades will make them bulletproof.

Forget about the Vendetta/Shark... those people are always wrenching here. And the Kyosho is just a stupid design... plus parts may be hard to get and are often expensive. The HB Minizilla is a joke, IMO. MQ could be nice too, just never seen them much racing here. Same goes for the Trinity, never ever saw one, can't comment on them.

I vote for AE on that one. And of course the XRay is nice too... just a bit too nice for our harsh offroading. If you drive indoors, get the XRay.

Daf

Awesome replay, just what I was after cheers :)

Is there any non-ball diff options for the 18t series? Any more info on the XRay? I would drive it in and outdoors, nothing too dirty though, generally a fairly well groomed home track as well. Youtube doesnt like my videos much (chops down the quality a lot), but heres the first few lap attempts on the first build of our track if your interested http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfCfql0Tixo fairly small now, plenty of room to expand though.

I used to have an rc18 and I jumped it off the fridge(dont ask) once and it didnt break. from then on I believed in the truck and NEVER broke on me. went through 2 motors and 2 speed controls and never had a problem with it.

I cant say much about the drivetrain as I was only using a 17t and a 6 cell. but with these light 1/18 it doesnt take a whole lot of power to make them go fast. I was happy with that much power and I own a VXL rusty with a 3s.

Cheers :smile:

I will have to check out your vid when I am home... no Youtube at work :sarcastic:
Hey, those tracks don't need to be big to have some good fun. Ours is pretty small too. Most times we race one-on-one, or play tag or whatever

Well, the ball diff is just fine in the RC18... does a good job. No other option that I am aware of.

The XRay is real nice, very similar to the RC18 in design. COmes with a steel spur, but on the other hand the gears are exposed, and no gear cover that I know of.

And yeah, I have been there, even well groomed dirt tracks will send dirt/stones into your open spur/pinion... just gives a funky sound, but still, with the gearcover on, those RC18 are real quiet. And the spurs live forever.

I considered the XRay for myself too, but it would be a shame for that nice carbon chassis on our track. Never liked CF anyway... you can check out the XRay line-up at teamxray.com

Have a good one

Daf

I have a heavlily modified RC18 and I would assemble the MIP super diffs in my spare time, so when I would strip one I had another to slap in. I tried differnt lubes in the diffs and Lithium grease being one of the better ones, its alo very important to make sure they have been shimmed properly

i've had 3 of the rc18's, all modified. very fun once you get everything settled in to handle power. i just got a xray m18t and its looking like a nicer truck already. big thing i noticed is the steering seems quicker and more precise. i haven't picked up a bl motor yet or i could give feedback on power handling. i've heard the diffs handle brushless as is with no upgrade. i already have esc and battery waiting.

I wouldn't cross off the Vendetta off the list too quickly. Once you factor in upgrades, I actually think that they are some of the toughest 1/18th's around. They only need cvd's and one ball diff in the rear to handle brushless. I have a Neu 1105/2Y in my vendetta, and the buggy handles it with no problems. Daf, I'm not sure what your friends are doing wrong, but I haven't had to wrench on my detta for months. I just clean it and replace bearings and tires from time to time. I actually have had a harder time wrenching on my rc18t's since you have to upgrade sooooo many things to get it up to par. I agree, that they are tough trucks, but they need a lot of fine tuning to handle brushless power reliably.

On another note, I also have a few xray's and I can confidently say these are my favorite 1/18th trucks. Tashpop is correct, the diffs can handle brushless power with no issues. You don't need to shim them, or get different outdrives. The steering set-up is arguably the best of any mini. Its tight, responsive, and no bump steer to speak of. Honestly, the only thing the truck needs are alloy cvd's (if you get the pro, they are included). And if you don't want the c.f. chassis, just get the standard kits.

Another decent option would be the new XTM Rage (sold by Jamara in Europe). It has a very strong drivetrain using open gear diffs. They can handle 3s lipos in stock form. The only downside is that there are no upgrades available yet, and it needs alloy knuckles.
Lastly, I wouldn't consider a MQ anymore since they are on their way out. Its a great truck, but parts availability may become an issue in the next year or so. These are getting phased out in favor of the Vendetta ST (both made by Anderson Racing in Taiwan).

In the end, these are the trucks I would recommend:
- Xray M18MT or M18T Pro (both highly recommended)
- Vendetta ST
- XTM Rage

I 2nd the xray m18t or m18t pro - awesome 1/18. I not been able to break a single part on it in over a year - stock.

Had a rc18 and although good, just like most other 1/18's out there you had to put a lot of extra money and work into it to make it handle decently. Out of the box the xray is super solid. Easier than the rc18 to work on, steering design is simply genius for a mini and rock solid servo saver.

I've had the RC18 ($300 extra into it), Mini-T ($200 extra into it), mLST ($800 extra into it and still a piece of sh*t) and the M18T is exponentially better (only upgrades - metal CVDs for the M18T for BL power and didn't really need them) - check out the m18t pro - all carbon fiber, cf driveshaft, hudy spring steel cvds - this thing is so light you don't even need rediculous power to make it go fast either.

I also have the M18t pro with a mild brushless system and it is one of the most precise rc's I have ever used. I bash it on pavement and indoors and have yet to break anything at all. I have no hop-ups except for a Castle 1/18 ESC, an AON motor and wheels + tires from X-ray's M18MT. It fits Thunderpower 2100 mah lipo's with no modification so it has crazy long run time.

The only downside with the M18T Pro is the exposed spur+ pinion which is why I am planning on building an Anderson MB4t which is exactly the same as the Vendetta ST but in kit form. I like building these almost as much as driving them. I already have a Neu 1105 on the way and am torn between using a Mamba micro pro (Which I hear is nothing more than a 1/18 sidewinder in a plastic case-w-heatsink and the 1/10 scale sidewinder. they are almost the same price and the 1/10 scale SW handles like 60 or 70 amps instead of 35.

Also in my opinion I would stay away from the mini lst series (2, baja, raminator, etc). It is too heavy and complicated to be reliable. it is nothing but a money pit that is down as much as it is up. And as heavy as it is it can only accept a 24mm motor which are barely big enough to efficently move that beast.

I owned almost every mini at one time, and found that the MQ SE model was the best. I have not had an Xray. I may have to buy one. MLst and the Mini t were junk, not good for brushless. I had good success with the vendetta buggy, and the MQ. I have had a few rc18t and they hold up well, save for the diffs. Sounds like the Xray is the best bet.

I totally agree that the Mini quake is AWESOME but it is in the process of being discontinued and that may mean that parts may get scarce in a year or so. Anderson (the manufacturer of Duratrax's 1/18th's) sells a mq that is even better than the MQ SE that Durtrax never decided to distribute. It is only like $185, when you consider all of the hopups that is cheap!!

The Vendetta seems to be about as good (Beter in some ways not as good in others) and should be around for a while as it was recently re-designed. I should have one in a couple of weeks (as soon as the kits are back in stock in Asia). I will post some pics and info on the build.

Oh... another thing I forgot to mention. The m18t pro can accept larger 28mm motors where as the original m18t can't (unless you buy the pro motor mount base). Max diameter for the normal m18t/mt motor mount is 24mm. So the pro opens up a lot more options in motors like neu 11 series, medusa 28's, and the ammo 28's. Duratrax/Anderson mini's are the only other ones that accept 28mm motors without mods.

And yes, I will agree that the MQ SE rocks. I still drive mine after over 3 years of owning it, and its still a blast to run. If anyone does decide to get one... keep a close eye on tower's clearance sales. They usually have fire sales on cvd's, ball diffs, and other parts every three months or so. If you're lucky, you can score cvd's for $10 and ball diffs for around $12-13 a pop. My parts box is overflowing with parts because I intend to run my quake for a long time to come. And when dtx finally decides to stop supporting it, the truck will have a well deserved place on my "vintage keeper" shelf.

Man I couldn't imagine a 28mm motor on a M18t pro. I guess that could be a good platform for top speed competitions. You could probably overgear it pretty bad and still keep the temps down just because it weighs nothing.... Hmmmm I have a neu 1105 2.5y coming Lets see:
Differential Ratio: 2.5
Transmission Ratio: 1
Other Ratio: 1
Spur Tooth Count: 54
Pinion Tooth Count: 20
Total Voltage: 11.1
Motor KV: 4000
Tire Diameter (inches): 2.75
Tire Ballooning (inches): 0
Motor Current Draw: 0
Motor coil Ω: 0
Spur/Pinion Ratio: 2.7 : 1
Total Ratio: 6.75 : 1
Tire Circumference (inches): 8.64 inches (219.44 mm)
Total Motor Speed: 44400 RPM
Vehicle Speed: 53.81 mph (86.44 km/h)
Effective Speed Rate: 4.85 mph/V (7.79 kmh/V)
Estimated Adjusted Speed: 50 mph (80 km/h) - 7% loss
Effective KV Value: 4000

Nice!!

Lol this is the part I don't like about forums... now I want to buy everything lol.

So basically the choice now is the rc18t FT kit (with big wheels for any monster action) or one of the xray kits. I already have a BL system for it (a very old school mamba 25 with a nice heatsink on it, cant even get it warm on 3s in the mlst lol...)... I've played with dtx a lot in the past and not sure I want to go back to them, other than that they also sound like a viable choice. I dont really like 8 shock setups much, really doesnt seem necessary on any car, especially a mini. Id prefer something thats designed to perform well and be durable, not just to look like an 8th scale :) So I am leaning toward the rc18t...

I nearly bought a mini inferno a few days ago, lol glad I didnt now.

Also I cant find the xtm rage anywhere, ill have to look harder. I like to stick to amain or tower cuz they have awesome international shipping, especially tower since they have killer discount codes too :)

I loved my 2 brushless rc18mt's. I sold the first to fund another project. And then I built up another brushless rc18mt. But then I sold that one too to fund another project... and now I really regret selling it. They are such a tough trucks and very fun to mess around with in the back yard, street or wherever you like. :yes:

I also only needed to upgrade the diffs maybe 3 or 4 months after installing the brushless system (Mamba 6800 system)... and I bashed it just about every day. however, I haven't tried any other mini's unfortunately to compare it too...

I have a MQ from the first month or so when they were sold here. It was the most frustrating rc I've ever owned. Strg slop was incredible making it almost impossible to drive at anything over a crawl. I even epoxied the servo to the chassis trying to eliminate any play. Finally was advised to try the graphite knucks and whoa! The very early ones plastic was just poor as were the early esc - mine lasted 3wks and the smoke got out. I didn't bother dtx for another, I wouldn't run it, waste of time. MQ been super since then and I've worn out 2 sets of chevron tires I've drive it so much, prob thru 6 or 7 motors. Its getting a mamb2 25 and an align with a FP 3S 1600 as soon as batt shows up. I expect that to kill the orig diffs finally and may need cvd, but I'll wait and see.

rschoi_75 is not the only to benefit from sudden TH unannounced, fire sales - I have enough to build it at least twice over for cheap. I bought my MQ-SE with TH discount code and its been good from the start. Mamba 25 and GH3500. I run with low kv since that doesn't seem to tear up drivetrains.

As big of a pain as my 1st MQ was, the Vendetta buggy has been the opposite in sweet. Its been nearly perfect. I went bl as soon as it arrived, mamba 25, CoolRed 3500kv heli motor (sale - $24.99 shiped) running either 2 or 3s. Only things ever happened - had dog bone pin come out of stock plastic cvd. A little CA for all and its never happened again. Solid yr and half running gear diffs hard before they went, $20 worth of ball diffs (on sale!) and its gone almost as long. Mine are run mainly in the street, mostly wot or near wot. Get 20+ min of fun everytime. Detta has been one of the best rcs I've owned.

this forum might be useful

http://www.one18th.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=171

Guh, I can't stand that forum. No offence to the people on it (or maybe it is?) but any other RC forum I've been on just seems to be filled with the biggest morons... it just frustrates me so much sifting through the useless crap some of them go on with... Kind of like traxxas or nk forum lol...
I hope noone takes that as me being too much of an elitist... it was semi toungue in cheek :P

Damn Australian elitists! I understand about the mini forum, they have a few decent members, but the bulk of the posts are crap. The NK and Traxxas forums seem to have quite a few newbs, Neil will atest to that!

I'm with you guys on your opinion of one18th.com. Aside from a handful of folks on there, of which, most of those are members here too, the forum is pretty sad. I would have to say though that this forum and rccrawler.com are the most informative forums I read. Rctech.net isn't bad for some things, but it's easy to run across guys on there that think that if you don't race, you don't know anything.

I quit visiting one18th.com some time ago after a bunch of posts. I finally got tired of what I term that race attitude. Most of the folks with that attitude need to grow up a little. I've watched long enough to see them wind up by themselves after turning everyone else off.

I check the BST (I've gotten some good deals there) over there from time to time, but will not be wasting my time posting.

I have to fourth the Mini Quake SE, I put mine through 7 levels of hades and it has survived well. I was running a 4700 golden horizions motor w/ a mamba 25 and 6 cells of NIMH (1400) and it would run and jump like a bigger truck. Our track at that time, had a dirt mound with a step type ramp to leap over it, distance to landing was about 15 feet and most buggies and truggies (1/8) would go 20+ feet. My MQ could come within a few feet and land, as though it were a bigger truck. The tumbles it took while trying to land that and many backflips (From 8+feet in the air) Gave it the name of the scud, As in the Iraqi missle that almost never landed where it should, it never broke in nearly a year of punishment. I do recomend that you tighten the diffs, they will loosen from time to time. I currently have a Neu 1107/2Y (3400kv) on a Mamba 25 esc W/1800 3s lipo, That setup is like a 2250 in a Emaxx on 6s Lipo, Just too much, The diffs are slipping but the Drivetrain is holding other wise

Was the MQ the RTR or SE? The RTR had some troubles that the SE corrected

Not 1/18th, but close... I want this guy

http://www.cenracing.com/censports/me16mt.html

1/16th using 1/10th pieces and parts. Should be pretty tough. Looks abit goofy, but the standard batt, and 1/10th tranny should help it out a bit. I like :).

J.

i also loved my miniquake se, but it liked to strip diffs on me. i was running a venom 4980kv v20 on 1100mah 3cell. very stable truck for straight line speed runs. i would just eat diffs too often so i sent it to ebay land.

i just need to add that i would easily rate it over a rc18 series.

So what makes it so much better than the rc18 series? Do rc18s tear through diffs like a mini lst?

Nothing goes thru diffs like a mlst. That truck is worse than a tyco. Unless you leave it stock you will have problems, maybe even if you leave it stock.

I had good success with my rc18ts after shimming the diffs. Not much else needed, as they are quite light weight.

Cool, yeah I was looking at getting a rc18t factory team kit and the mip super diffs and cvds... maybe not the cvds I'm not sure. I'm wary of MIP though, ive had bad experiences with their gear before.

I still don't understand why no third party has bothered releasing steel spider gears for the mlst.. i mean they make steel spur gears... but why? and why has no company released them? is there some technical challenge with gears that small or something? I've half a mind to get a few hundred made up and start my own damn business... Thats the only problem I've found with that truck... those freakin spider gears! :( and I really dont like ball diffs.. which is why i steered clear of the others in the first place

i FINALLY broke a rear lower arms this mourning on my trinity now, its the only thing that has broke or messed up since i built the new chassis, ill stand behind what i said that this truck is tough and really handles well with a new chassis, only gripe i have found on the truck is the open gear diffs, they are tough and handle the brushless no problems but it is hard to get used to cornering with them under power, you kinda gotta point and shoot drive it around the track to be consistant, but hey it doesnt throw parts 24/7 like my mlst and it was alot cheaper.

i have had my eyes on my xray m18t tho just the kit and i could put all my spare electronics in it.......

You guys make me want to buy some mini rcs again, but I have to keep reminding myself why I sold all of them. They may be able to take a beating, but nothing like a savage can handle!

I was looking at those too. The biggest downside is they weigh about 5 pounds... Heavier than a 1/10th t-4, XXX-t etc so it is going to have a hard time keeping up with most things out there. It is also about the size of a crt.5, they absolutely dwarf the other 1/16 mini's out there. On the other hand looks like a really fun platform and if they prove to be durable and start getting a decent amount of hopups I am going to get one.

I also think they look really cool. I swear if I get another stadium truck bodied rc I am going to scream..... Not that they look bad but they all look the same.

I still try to be helpful on that forum ... :angel: .... even though it does get a bit frustrating trying to sift through all the useless info. But I guess that's like any forum... for every good thread, there are 10 useless ones. And since its a dedicated mini only forum, you're bound to get more beginners on that site. Like any online forum, I try to learn what I can, and leave the arguing to the other members.... (unless I get screwed on a trade/deal, but that's another topic all together)... :yes:


On another note...

Linc, I'm surprised you don't have any mini's left. I'd expect you of all people to have at least two or three of them. There's a place and time for all scales of rc, and I still like playing with mini's from time to time. They come in real handy when you're waiting for your lipo's to charge, or to chase the dog around. :smile:

Very true but you can buy a vendetta for about $150, bulletproof it for about another $150. Get a Stupidly powerful motor for $70, good esc $75 Flightpower Lipo 3s 1600 mah $50. Less than $500 you have a fast and tough basher.

I totally admit that I really really want an flm savage but:
Savage ss (after selling the motor) $300, FLM chassis $200, MMM + motor $300, Good lipo $250, misc servos etc $150

For that you can get 2 minis and enough lipos that you and a friend could bash for hours on end without having to recharge.

I do understand what you are saying though when all is said and done; when you put a savage next to a mini it is hard to justify the mini.

Sorry been busy at work, but the one I was talking about was the rtr - once you got above 10-12mph, it would take over and fromn there all I could do was try to correct direction it was heading off on. The inertia at that speed and the woefully elastic strg knucks would let it drift badly. Graphite parts fixed all that and I benefited from all the mods done trying to fix strg slop (epoxy servo to chassis, alum bellcranks with brgs, shimmed strg posts to eliminate vertical play, alum shocks, green springs etc). Once it was fixed, I liked it well enough I bought an SE. It never had the probs my rtr did! Made some improvements ther, you're absolutely right!

MQ or buggy Vendetta stock drive train won't live long with motor kvs > 4500 or so. I've tried Hyp 5000long can and I a GH4700. I swapped them in favor of a GH3500 and the CoolRed 3500. If I want stupid fast - 3s until I get over it, lol!

So I've had a few recommendations for the rc18 and the xray m18, but I noticed both of these have plastic ring/pinion gear in the front and rear diff... can these really stand up to brushless power? these got eaten so easily in the lst1 that even losi released metal ring/pinion gears. (the same losi who refuse to make steel spider gears for the truck, which would make it 100000x better)

I ran through probably 20 packs with my RC18T before I stripped a rear diff. I was running a Mamba 6800 system in it using up to 2S Lipo or 8 NiMh cells. I didn't strip it until I started jumping it and landing it on flat ground more often than normal. The diffs are pretty darn tough if you shim them when you get them.

I just sold the mq, and the NIB mq that I had. I have a tamiya m03 fwd suzuki swift that I like to play with. It is small and alot of fun, plus it holds up alot better than the mini vehicles. I may buy an xray, but we will see.

These can take the bl power. I have a rc18t with buggy wing like new for sale in a thread on here. Has many many upgrades and with take a beating. (all carbon, RPM, Alloy, MIP rear) Really sweet ride.
Take a look. http://www.rc-monster.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12107
Really like these mini for they are tough and fast, they will literally take off in the air at top speeds.

I never found a need for these but if you feel inclined: http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXKBC2&P=Z