Building a Better Wheelchair
 

Builders log day one: :intello:
The project was introduced to the team today with overwhelming support! The RCM Family ROCKS..

http://www.rc-monster.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17191


I'm starting this project off with the TDC S0-Cal special “Beach and Snow chair. :party:


http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/i...our-large-.jpg


This chair is currently on sale everywhere on the net as a PVC Wheelchair. The lowest I found it for was $1,099.00 the most expensive I found it for was $1,345.00.

Let’s see what I can build it for: :eyes:

Build log day one continued: :lol:

I went to Home depot today and purchased everything I think I need to construct the basic chair. I'm missing the seat and wheels (need to find those!) but where moving forward.

The chair will be constructed with ¾” 200 PSI PVC. I’ll provide a full count of all elbows; T’s and total lineal footage used at the end of the build.

Total cost for materials to date: $86.45
Total labor (shopping) 1hr

http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/i...s/IMG_4287.jpg




Proposed Project Features:
• Durable non-corrosive PVC construction
• Stainless steel hardware
• Easily disassembles into 3 pieces for transport (hopfully!) wink..
• Single motion parking brake
• 250lb (weight capacity)
• Anti-tip design (why because we care)
• Adjustable safety belt (I'm using 2”) is that good ???
• 6ft, 8 panel umbrella (don’t get to excited) this is $14.00 Target umbrella
• Spacious storage bag area (you supply your own bag)
• Sliding footrest
• Comfortable cushion seat (IE Target!) $12.00


Benefits:
• 4-wheel design prevents tipping
• Large wheel design for snow and other soft soils


Project Specifications:
• 41” high x 34.5” wide x 41” deep
• Seat Height 25”


That’s all for now I’ll start cutting up things after dinner! I should have it completed by the weekend.. I'm also going to do dye the PVC what color should it be?? I'm thinking HOT RED or Blue ??

(Help!)
I NEED WHEELS and suggestions for the SEAT!.. Any and all help is deeply appreciated!..

Thanks guys..

Shaun.

P.S.
If someone can please give me the dimensions for a child chair I can make one too. :yes:

?

http://cgi.ebay.com/4-STROKE-50CC-70...3286.m20.l1116

http://trus.imageg.net/graphics/prod...-5144027dt.jpg

I think you should paint it a dark/burnt orange colour. Check out harbour freight for wheel ideas. A go-cart seat or similar would work well.

Problem- only 1 available and $56 for it! :oh:

a tire with an agressive tread patter like the 4 wheeler tire posted earlier is going to have alot of rolling resistance especially in soft stuff like sand.

I would looke for a tire with little to no tread, or something that isnt going to fight the terrain. maybe some mower tires if you cant find any smooth ones.

I just found these, and they seem ok. they have very subtle treads, are fairly cheap, have bearings, and are 16 inches tall.

http://cgi.ebay.com/4-Wheelbarrow-Ca...3A1%7C294%3A50

This is what I was trying to find...

http://www.chillingtonbarrows.co.uk/...large/9404.jpg

yeah thats pretty much the tire I had in mind but I didnt feel like going through multiple pages on ebay, and then when I finaly did see one when I went into the description it said "tread pattern may vary". and I couldnt find one that had bearings.

seat............http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/te...=0180101070502

Wheel update:
 

Thanks for all of the great ideas guys :yipi: and (Dirt101) thanks for stopping and helping out.:wink: Actually thank you all for helping out!! :party:


Ok I did some research too and found this out: :whistle:

These are the industry standard wheels, I don’t know why but the one I need 19x9 is $119.99 per wheel (WTF) halfway down middle of the page:

http://www.beachcartsusa.com



Lucky for me!.. :yes:
After some great ideas posted earlier (BL_RVO, Arct1k) “a light went off” and I checked into golf course lawn mower wheels and Baja buggy wheel and found these bad boys (18x8) for 59.99 each wheel..

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/w...ategory%20Page


These are still a lot of money but my best option at this point, what I’m really looking for are fiberglass ones.. Something that are balloon shaped and (big) the lighter the better.. thanks..

Quick recap:
Their wheels @ $480 for 4 19”x9”
My wheels @ $240 for 4 18”x8”

I'm thinking it real hard to justify spending and extra $240.00 for 1” (or am I missing something) :neutral: Is it in the overall weight?? The one I'm looking at are about 14lbs per wheel, unfortunately I cant find the weight of the “Wheeleez” wheels but the rims do look plastic.. :oh: so I could be missing the boat??? Gentlemen your thoughts please!!!

I also found some 1” axels for $29.00 each (?) can anyone make them for me cheaper??. It’s just a hollow alum tube that is 1 Inch X 34 Inch :whistle:

And last but not least I found some quick clip retainer pin for easy off / on for the wheels. These are $4.54 for two.

So the total cost for the wheels (everything) is the following:
$240.00 for (4) Wheel, rims and they come with sealed bearings
$60.00 for (2) 1” x 34” axels
$10.00 for axel / wheels clips

Total $310.00 for parts
Another 1hr of labor used up..

Builders Note: :oops:
WHAT DO I DO???? I'm at a impass and I really need some to step in and HELP ME.. Do build this chair with 4 BIG WHEELS or do I build it with two BIG wheels up front and use a two smaller one (12x8) in the rears on Swivel Casters ?? I'm thinking that swivel casters wont really do anything in the sand or snow but I’ve seen some with them and some with out them.. YOUR THOUGHTS PLEASE..

Thanks Guys.. sorry to be pain in the butt..

Team help required: :wink:
1. Your thoughts on the proper wheel selection
2. Your thoughts on an alterative axel IE $60.00 for 76” of 1” alum is a lot (wright??)
3. Your thoughts on the 4 big wheel vrs the two big and two swivel..

Technical advisers needed! 2-4 Preferred!
 

Hey guys :intello:
I'm looking for a few kind harted soals / people I can PM / bounce email / ideas off of and I was wondering who would like volunteer to get to know me a little better :lol: :yipi:

Preferably you need to have first hand experience in the areas of wheelchair knowledge :yes: IE what will work and be comfortable for the end user!.. :yes: I can’t pay you :no: (sorry) but I will include your name in all upcoming How to video’s :intello:

Thanks for your time guys..

:surprised: I think that's GREAT!!:yipi:

thanks sir.. :yes:

Count On.
 

You can count me in Shaun, but as you have seen I do not just babble unless I think what I have to say will benefit in some way. I think what you are doing is a great idea. Especially with the prices some of these knuckleheads are charging for these different styles of wheelchairs. I think that you may be on to something with this project. In fact it may turn out to be a great side job/money maker, and yet still save people some money by providing an alternative that is affordable. BUT for sure you have to charge Harold double for his chair. :lol::rofl::intello::lol::rofl::intello: Don't fall out of your chair laughing old man.

hey guys.

I too want to help anyway I can. This is a great project.
I did some searching on the net and found some things/sites that may help;

I saw this;
http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k1...hotostory5.jpg

It was here;
http://www.wheeleez.com/

I thought maybe they would have more info on it, but have not contacted them yet.

Their site has some better prices on wheels and such.

I also found a guy who makes his own wheels for the beach. He setup a How-to of sorts here;
http://www.geocities.com/mec_coleman/tip13.htm

anyway, hope that helps some.

Shocks!,
 

Why do Wheelchairs don’t have shocks?? :neutral:

Would it better to install them at the wheels or under the seat?? :intello:

Thanks guys!..:yipi:

GREAT!!! thank you SIR.. the first thread I've seen and the wheels are $119 each.. Yikes!..

The second one is the BEST!!! I'm trying that tonight / when I got off work!..

BIG TIME!!!! THANK YOU!!!!!! :yipi: :intello:

Shaun,

2 large wheels up front and smaller in the rear on casters or vice versa would probably work just fine.

Hovv's plastic drum find is fantastic! The only downside I see to that is if you go to a rocky beach they may not roll well over the rocks, where a rubber tire would. It would be hard to get it over obstacles as well do to lack of traction unless perhaps you wrap them in a rubber sleeve? Like mouse pad material. or at least make a few wide strips around the circumference to add some traction.

Great point Dicky!..:wink: the rocks would be problematic!.. but as you stated above I can wrap them with something that would work.. :smile:

Hovv's find was an outstanding pull! :yes: it saves me over $200 on tires alone and about 40 lbs of weight!.. Just a huge pull!!! :party:

Thanks for everything!..

after looking at several, i really think te big wheel vs small wheel thing is personal preference.

big front, small rear
http://www.wheeleez.com/images/Healthline/rolleez.jpg

big rear, small front
http://www.wheeleez.com/images/OEM/h..._large-125.jpg

big x4
http://www.wheeleez.com/images/OEM/J...view01-125.jpg

low rider (low cog) (alum frame) big front small rear
http://www.wheeleez.com/images/OEM/d...mb2-150px-.jpg

the accesory chair
http://www.wheeleez.com/images/PLFD_ramp_down.jpg

pm me all you want, I'm not doing nothing but playing on rc-monster and forming class action lawsuits:lol: The 2-4 wheel debate: it won't effect the passenger, only the person pushing it, and in sand they are expecting some work. I think to cut down on weight and complexity 4 fixed wheels. The wheels need to be as large as possible for less rolling resistance, but that has to balanced with the added weight.

Pushing????
 

Whos going to push anything??:oh: I thought that we were going for a brushless powered beach chair:yipi:. After all is this not the worlds best Brushless site?? This thing has to be a remote control brushless chair that will take the wheelchair world by storm or whats the point...:yes:

on the "expensive model" he is trying to make a budget wheel chair first to bring mobility to more that need it.

There went cheep.:mdr:

Well, i think the most important thing to most disabled people is independence, and i think a manual chair just doesn't cut it in my opinion. A powerchair would be at the top of my list.

^^^^^^^^+1! Mine tops out at 7.5 and can climb like a 20 degree incline if that

Who are you building this wheelchair for?

Wow Dicky Thank you for the effort!! your too kind! I really do appreciate it..

Thank you!.

Shaun.



Jery!, you've been on fire / your "A" game lately!.. All happy and having a great time with us all in your post.. WAY TO GO SIR!..:wink: I ilke it when your relaxed and can have some fun.. I was still blown away in "where's linc" you had everybody doing bouble takes.. whatever is going on GO WITH IT!..

As for the BL beach chair that will come!.. Please you know me of course that will come :yes: but for now I'm just going to start out slow and build my first prototype, if and when it works then I'll either add to it or start over with greater knowledge and then build BL.. I still want to try to build my 3rd world one out of bike's and i've got a few other things going on so it might take a while but I will get to it! I can guarantee that before the year (09) is over I’ll have out the baddest 4 wheel, 4 steering, all terrain chair with upper and lower airdams and rear smoke system going 20+.. or IE next years project “X” winner!.. LOL.LOL.LOL..

Thank you for also volunteering earlier Sir..

Have a great one Jerry and I hope you keep your new and improved mood!..

Shaun…


I totally agree and I’m listening..:yes: But for my first one I'm going manual, I want to know what it takes to build $1200 beach chair.. Then I'll either work on my 3rd world chair and or do a BL one.. But I will have one soon so if you can please start to think about the drive system for it that would be killer!. :yes:

Here is what has been offered up thus far by TexasSP. :whistle: http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/s...28eq:_70-55%29

I'll probably need at least two total of them if not one per wheel..

What do you think?? got any other recommendations??

Thanks for your time and your input as it is always much appreciated!..:smile:

Thanks – Shaun..


I can and will do better than that! but I guess I need to ask what is / should the top speed be?? that quickest one I've seen went 10mph, so how quick do I go paralyzed?? do I double it?? and what kind of runtime should I account for during a typical day ?? :neutral:

Thank you so much for your time sir..

Shaun.


We'll it a prototype for now! I really don’t have any plans on selling it at the moment, it would be nice to complete it before Christmas and give it the Huntington beach parks and rec for a Christmas present.. I mean how cool would it be to take my kids to the beach (3 miles away) next summer and see Dad’s chair being used!..

Or I’ll find someone who really needs and will use it, then I'll pass it along as a gift from all of us..

Or TBD?? LOL.LOL


Have a great BL and thanks for stopping by..

Shaun.

Moral dilemma:
 

I need some good solid advise here guys!..:whistle: (Thanks)

Hey guys..
I found something that will work GREAT for the wheels but I started to think about exactly what is it that I'm building? The thread name is (building a better wheelchair) and this is not better it’s just cheaper!, I want to make people feel good about them self’s and even know these alternates will work! And they will save weight and money, I just honestly don’t think they will make people feel better about themselves. I don’t want to cheapen it do I??

Or??:neutral:

Should I look at it as I'm helping getting someone out and exposed to elements that they would typically not be exposed too . I'm really afraid that if I use anything other than wheels I might not be reaching my goal of providing a better chair.. so with that said I'm going to installing four of these https://www.northerntool.com/webapp/...Product%20Page

I found some moon hubcaps that will fit and if I paint the rims to match the chair!, then I'm right back on track for building a better chair and even if I go this route I’ll still only have under $400 to date in it.. Including 1” axels with sealed bearings (so now I'm back up ahead) of the game / my goal of building / providing a better chair of less..

What do think?? Build it cheaper or build it better ?? I'm thinking better.:angel:

Better.
 

Its like you said. "Build a better wheelchair" is your goal. Of course you want to keep your expenses resonable, but not at the cost of dialing down your design and making a piece of junk. If you get a little bit confused just take a gander at your XRay project. Look at the work you put into that and you never compromised on your materials. So why should you start now? Knowing you this chair will end up being a $1000 chair, but it will not be JUST a wheelchair. From there you can go either upwards and add on BL power and whatever else someone may desire, or you can dial it down to reduce the price, but at least everyone will see what you can offer. It is like buying a new car. No one wants to look at a stripped down cheapo to start out with. We want to see the power package, tow package, alloy wheels, 10 speaker stereo system, and whatever else they can offer. So go for teh gusto Shaun.:lol:

You Are The Man!!
 

Thank you Jerry thank you Jerry! THANK YOU JERRY!!

For putting it such simple but STRONG terms:yes:.. I’ve never compromised on any of my builds :no: why would I even think about compromising on someone’s mod of transpiration…:slap: This answer could have never been said better!!..:smile:. It hit HOME!.. :intello:


:oops: I'm ashamed of myself for even considering it now.. :whip:

I'm sorry / Apologize to the team! :yes: I got swept up in the moment for a better buck chair!.. It’s wont happen again.. :no:



Thank you SIR…. :party:

Shaun..

I've seen 11 and 12 mph chairs and the users said that was just flying! I think 15 is a nice number, it would definitely have to be marketed as extreme, and run at your own risk! A 2:1 two speed would be so awesome, hill climbing torque and high speed. I have an led 10 bar battery meter and on a typical day I will use one bar of power, and that's 16 hr's of use. The only time I ever killed my batteries was when I made multiple 5 mile trips. 12v sealed gel lead acid batteries are the standard and the only battery approved for flight.

Gels.
 

Yea the gel batteries are probably the best and safest ones on the market for such use. They are virtually harmless and they give quite a long storage capacity, but the makers know this an charge like 3 to 4 times as much at regular lead acid batteries. I think it is a pitty as they are trying to get rich from a simple idea that isn't some major breakthrough in technology. Anyway Gels would probably be the best idea for this project. I believe they run about $100 to $150 for good cells. The good thing is there is no risk of spillage.

Shaun,

I like the wheels form northern tool and they most certainly get back on track with better, not cheaper. your original plan was to build a cheaper better chair. I love te idea of moon caps color matched to the chair!

The only possible Isse I see with those northern tool tires is tey are conventional in tire shape and may sink into the sand. they will be GREAT on al other surfaces, but forsand tey may be a bit rough for the pusher to push.

That may be why the pricey chair from wheeleez uses to round balloon tires?

I think 2 of those giant outrunners would be perfect for the bl version.

I found http://www.hotshotproducts.org/roleez_wheels.htm#49cmg - same thing a bit cheaper than wheeleez. still looking for mo better cheapa options.



edit hmmm. it seems that roleez has gone out of business. Their website gives the following message:

Dear Visitor:

Roleez® brand wheels are no longer available through this website.

Should you be interested in beach or balloon wheels and beach products like Beach Carts, please visit www.google.com to look for such items.

For sourcing and market consulting in Asia, please contact Primex Marketing, Inc. either via telephone 1-707-746-6855 (USA) or send your inquiry to info@primexmarketing.com.

Thank you for your understanding. We regret the inconvenience.


edit again:
I found these: http://chihyoungindl.trustpass.aliba...oon_wheel.html
no pricing listed, i have contacted them and requested pricing info per unit.

and for the ALL TERRAIN chair! http://chihyoungindl.trustpass.aliba...arm_wheel.html

[/QUOTE]I totally agree and I’m listening..:yes: But for my first one I'm going manual, I want to know what it takes to build $1200 beach chair.. Then I'll either work on my 3rd world chair and or do a BL one.. But I will have one soon so if you can please start to think about the drive system for it that would be killer!. :yes:

Here is what has been offered up thus far by TexasSP. :whistle: http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/s...28eq:_70-55%29

I'll probably need at least two total of them if not one per wheel..

What do you think?? got any other recommendations??

Thanks for your time and your input as it is always much appreciated!..:smile
I can and will do better than that! but I guess I need to ask what is / should the top speed be?? that quickest one I've seen went 10mph, so how quick do I go paralyzed?? do I double it?? and what kind of runtime should I account for during a typical day ?? :neutral:[/QUOTE]

The HobbyCity 180kv outrunner would be great if outrunners r as good as people say they r (never had personal experience with one). I would suggest one on every drive wheel. I must ask though, how dependable r these motors?, i mean it isn't like our rc's that u can simply pick up and take home to fix, if the chair breaks down u r stuck until someones finds u; not good if its cold outside. I think 15mph is good number to shoot for. My chair will do a 16 mile range @ full tilt(7.5mph), so i would like to at least that of range on a single charge going 15mph.

Control is also on the top of the list, it can't be a 2-speed; 1st speed is stop and 2nd speed being "OH CRAP, SO FAST MY EYES R BLEEDING! My powerchair has such fine-tuned control that i leave it on it's full power setting all the time. I can creep, go full-tilt,and everything in between all on the full power setting.

I had some guys who built me some very nice analog joysticks for some machinery I had. They had a variety of options and specs. I will try and find the name and contact information.

all of that programming is in the controller. There are 2 or 3 manufacturers of controllers(joysticks) that all of the wheelchair manufacturers share. The sophistication and complexity of the controller will be very hard to meet, and for the controller the chair should use existing parts. The controllers can control top speed, braking speed, joystick sensitivity, joystick throw, acceleration, turning speed, turning acceleration, reverse speed, torque, more I forgot and have 5-6 different programmable drive profiles, along with being able to control several peripherals, such as tilt, recline, elevate.... unless we can do better!!!!!!!!

How many amps can a stock powerchair controller handle? Also, is a powerchairs speed restricted from the controller or the gear motors on them. I mean the best motors money can buy would still only get u to 7.5mph if the controller is what constricts it.

I've been looking, but haven't found a BL esc that can handle 150amp@48v that would go with the huge HC outrunner, not a cheaper one anyway.

this seat may be better on the arsssss

http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/te...0064117018144a




also i want to commend you for doing something so nobel , and wish you the best with this build

Nice.
 

That chair actually looks very nice, and it looks to be quite comfortable. Nice choice if you ask me, and only $90 which seems to be worth the extra comfort.