1518/1520/1717 Replacements
 

Since the Clearance Sale ended, I figured there would be some new products (motors) released to fill the void. Perhaps I'm just oblivious to what's going on, however I'm in need of a few new motors and was wondering what is out there to replace the ever popular 1518, 1520 and 1717 motors?

I saw a couple shots from a few months ago with a whack of motors lined up beside each other and a few in the background that were "works in progress".

Can anyone provide any decent feedback? Got my credit card ready :)

You can buy the "Neu" line of motors through Castle, more expensive but worth every penny IMHO :-)

I have CM36, 1415, 1518, and 1717 Castle motors as well as 1107, 1409, and 1515 Neu motors... I like the Neu's a bit more. I know the efficiency is only a few percent higher but I swear I'd know the difference in a blind test.

You've got a much broader choice of KV's in the Neu line as well.

Thanks for the info. I guess I never took the time (or had much knowledge) of the Neu offerings.

I guess I was more misled as I assumed the motors were more for the pictured boats, planes and helis, etc. I should just bite the bullet and order a couple up.

Thanks again.

KV versus application is everything when picking the right motor. The reason I have so many motors is trial and error :-) it can get expensive fast...

What RC are you buying the motor for?
What ESC are you using? at what voltage?
What environment will the RC see most? (bashing, racing, speed runs)

I've been really busy and haven't been kept up with what's going on so pardon my ignorance but...WHAT? I checked the site today and they are, indeed, discontinued. Any ideas why? They surely sold well enough and were very reliable. I've had 2 1717s and got my brother lined up with one for his Summitt while they were still on sale and can see no reason to discontinue the line...

Cc's answer.
 

Patrick from CC dropped in a few weeks back to let people know that they were planning a new release shortly of repair kits for a few of those motors including the 1717. He also stated that with the huge response throughout the CC sale that they were working on refilling their stocks for a few of those motors as well (including the 1717). If you just can not wait shoot Patirck a PM and ask him directly.

So they're going to offer repair kits and eventually put the motors back into production?

Exactly
 

That was pretty much the exact thing that Patrick shared with us. He is the man so I would think that his word is golden.

Sounds good. Would be a shame to see those motors gone forever...

They will be coming back soon...

Not positive about the 1717 tho. We do have replacement rotors for the 1717 on the way.

Well that's good. Is the 1717 just not making enough profit to be worth producing?

Please Pat don't can the 1717 motor. Thing is a beast. The only change I would like to see is lower kv one so we can run it safely on 8S. maybe make it 1719 or 1720 with kv around 1200kv. That would be stump puller combined with the MMMXL on 8S.

A 1720 motor with lower kv would be the hot ticket. Nice to offer that with the mamba xl as a combo.

Amen. That would be a perfect set up for light 1/5th trucks or obese 1/8th ones. I honestly can't believe that the motors they cleared out were selling so poorly. I love every one of them. 1518 in my buggy, 1520 in my truggy and I haven't used the 1717 yet but I have seen what they can do. It will be going into a Savage eventually.

Anyway how bad do you guys think it will be to run the 1717 on 8S? I know that puts it @ 53,000rpm but with some voltage drop and load on the motor would it be possible for it to hold together for a few runs. I guess I could try 7S but would prefer to give 8S a crack.

How much more power does the 1717 put out compared to a 1518? I have both, and it seems to me that the 1717 doesn't have the acceleration the smaller can does... The KV's are a bit different, but I think there's more to it than the max RPM?

I think it would be neat to see a "dyno chart" of both motors and maybe a 1521 (Steve) Neu as well :-)

Wonder how time consuming it would be to rig up some kind of dyno to load the motor (airplane prop with an added weight on it?) and use my MMXL to log the data. Hmmmm...

From what I can tell the 1717 should produce power levels between the 1521 and 1527. Patrick sort of verified this.

Since the diameter of the rotor is larger the 1717 will not spin up as fast, but will produce more low end torque than a 15 series motor in the same length.

I noticed a big difference in torque on my lst, compared to a neu 1521 1y (1600kv).

I think a large 17 series lower kv motor would make a great 8s choice for larger MT conversions, like the big savvy, lst, and cen trucks. Pair it with the mmxl. Would also be a good option for the current crop of 5th scale 4x4s that mimick the 1/8 buggy/truggy layouts.

The 2028 is a HUGE motor, and probably overkill for everything lighter than a 5b/t. Would be nice to have something between it and the 15 series motors.

This would be a beast and sell very well IMO, The 2028 is just too much for most apps.

Watch temps and don't push it to it's max speed and it should be an absolute animal. Patrick said a while back that they're rated to 45,000 RPM because the magnets will start coming apart at higher speeds. I've run this motor on 4s and 6s and it's stupidly powerful in a very heavy 1/8th scale Truggy, 8s would push a 5th scale pretty well if you were smart about your setup and watch temps. Main problem I see with running it on 8s is accidentally over-revving it, I'd stick to 7s max myself.

Hmmmmm, I think you are right about 7S but I want to fit this setup to a Savage flux and fit one 4S batt on both sides. Going to 7S might cause bit of a imbalance. That is the main reason why I wanted to go with 8S. Wouldn't be nice if the MMXL had a rpm limiter. You just dial into the CC Link what your motors safe rmp is and presto, can't over rev it.

Being a such a over powered rig it will be doing a lot of back flips and spending a lot of time in the air with a fair bit of throttle input for flipping and correcting during flight. This is where I see the over reving becoming an issue. I would hate to destroy one of these motors before Castle starts to make something similar again.

Why couldn't you limit the throttle to about 90% in the ESC setup?

What you will find is going to be an insanely overpowered beast anyway. :yes:

It always amazes me how I manage to overlook the most simple of things or just over complicate. Limiting throttle is a brilliant idea. I do remember BrianG saying somewhere that limiting throttle EPA to slow down your car isn't a good idea. What would be the difference between doing that (setting the throttle EPA to say 85-90%) and just not using the full throttle? I know what he said has to do with the FETs having the easiest time when they are operating at full throttle but not exactly sure about this.

Limiting throttle doesn't have as much effect on peak RPMs, especially unloaded RPMs, as you might expect.

Quite some time ago I did some tests where I gradually turned down my throttle endpoint and measured the top speed of the car at each step. At 70% throttle, I was still at 90+% of top speed.

I was doing this to test the effect of "throttle driving" (a racer term few bashers would understand or comprehend) in a spec class with limited battery. Knowing how to do this got me many wins because I always had battery left over at the end of the race when others were on the verge of dumping because they were pulling full throttle down the straights all the time.

This was a long time ago, but the principle still applies.

Remember, if you turn your EPA down 10%, the ESC is applying full power 90% of the time and you are coasting the other 10% (admittedly in very small increments). But that 100% power, even if only for 90% of the time, is going to get you pretty close to the top speed at 100% EPA.

I've run my ERBE with a 1717 on 8s multiple times, and hit top speed every single run I've gone out on. The highest RPM I've gotten is 43k, but the Revo does have a huge amount of gears between the motor and the wheels.

I think the Mamba controllers would be awesome with an RPM limit feature, for this very reason. I've ran (carefully) a 13800Kv motor in my TC5R and if the MMP had RPM limiting then I wouldn't have to worry as much.

Boiling that down means - you will have similar top speed and slightly less grunt on take off due to drawing less amps.

I beleive the fet's would suffer if you had it overgeared and used the epa to 'tune' the car but what has been suggested sounds reasonable to me. The fet's are most efficient at full throttle but if the lesser epa reduces amp draw (which is likely to be high on take off with this motor) then I don't see why it wouldn't benefit?? I guess you could use the punch control feature to the same affect?

Shonen do you give it full throttle in the air? If it's just a speed run then wouldn't drag play some part in keeping rev's down?

8s * 1600kv = 47360 revs
fully charged 8s * 1600kv = 53760 revs (but not likely for various losses)

Sounds like it's on parr with a 1524.... I have one of those :yipi: and it should be easier to mount and spin up better than the 1717 :party:

I can try to free rev it in the air and see what the log says, but 7.9% RPM loss sounds fairly low for aero drag on top of the drag from all 28 bearings and 21 gears. The only ceramics are in the 1717 itself, all the other bearings are either stock or Boca 99c. But yes, aero definitely does play a role in reducing top RPM, especially when it's geared for 75mph.

Are there any chance the replacement for 1518/1520 AND 1717 are releasing soon?

Apparently not, I'm researching the exact same question myself now lol. I'll probably just sack up and buy a 1717 for 150 on fleabay lol.

:yipi::yipi::yipi::yipi:
You make this day a great day !!!.... so I gonna run my MGT just now !! (7:53 a.m :eyes:)

I wouldn't get too excited:
http://www.rc-monster.com/forum/show...12&postcount=8

So when new CC link version is going out, Patrick?:whistle:

looking for a 1717 rotor replacement anyone have a line on one ?

thanks in advance