A123 picks up $249m of your money... - RC-Monster Forums

Arct1k · **A123 picks up $249m of your money... -** 08.06.2009, 08:20 AM

"It hasn't been much of a secret that the US government was planning to dole out a couple of billion in battery-related grants to automakers this week, but we only got the details on who gets what today when Vice President Joe Biden made the big announcement himself in Detroit. As you might expect, the big three automakers all got a sizable chunk of the $2.4 billion up for grabs, with GM snagging $240 million for three separate grants, Ford getting $92.7 million (part of which will fund an electric-drive-parts facility in Michigan), and Chrysler receiving $70 million to develop and deploy advanced plug-in hybrid pickups and minivans. The single biggest winner, however, is Johnson Controls Inc., which got close to $300 million to produce battery parts for hybrid and electric vehicles. Chrysler partner A123 Systems Inc. was the next highest with $249.1 million, while EnerDel got $118.5 million that it'll use for its Indianapolis plant that produces lithium-ion cells and battery packs."

JThiessen · 08.06.2009, 08:45 AM

'bout time to public.....

BrianG · 08.06.2009, 10:02 AM

We pay them so they can charge us again down the line. Disgusting.

brushlessboy16 · 08.06.2009, 10:07 AM

Im going to go around looking for wrecked Chrysler vehicles... if I start selling massive amounts of A123 cells you guys know why.

nitrostarter · 08.06.2009, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrianG

We pay them so they can charge us again down the line. Disgusting.

I wish that was the only thing that disgusts me these days... Screwed up govt...

JThiessen · 08.06.2009, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrianG

We pay them so they can charge us again down the line. Disgusting.

While that may be true, the tax money going to them should be earmarked for research and development, and hopefully there will be some amount of oversight on them.
These battey systems are going to require some sort of eureka! from one of these companies.

lutach · 11:46 AM

I think they got over $1 billion.

Edit: The $1.2 billion was for a few companies, sorry for my mistake.

zeropointbug · 12:33 PM

Well if A123 is going to bring their new battery to market in the next 2 years, then sure. Take a look.. it will be able to do 400C discharge.

http://www.gizmag.com/lithium-ion-ba...ugh-mit/11244/

But on the other hand, ya, you guys are paying for that shit, and then paying again for it down the road. You guys should be up in arms for what your government is doing. I should be too...

lutach · 08.06.2009, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeropointbug

Well if A123 is going to bring their new battery to market in the next 2 years, then sure. Take a look.. it will be able to do 400C discharge.

http://www.gizmag.com/lithium-ion-ba...ugh-mit/11244/

I can't wait lol.

BrianG · 08.06.2009, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JThiessen

While that may be true, the tax money going to them should be earmarked for research and development, and hopefully there will be some amount of oversight on them.
These battey systems are going to require some sort of eureka! from one of these companies.

I guess my issue is choice. If I want to buy any battery, it's my choice. Paying these battery companies via taxes removes that choice. It's simply the gov't doing whatever the hell they want with money they did not earn. If they want to subsidize battery technology (or car/bank bailouts for that matter), add other little checkboxes (where you can donate for presidential elections) in the tax return forms so people can donate what they want.

JThiessen · 08.06.2009, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeropointbug

Well if A123 is going to bring their new battery to market in the next 2 years, then sure. Take a look.. it will be able to do 400C discharge.

http://www.gizmag.com/lithium-ion-ba...ugh-mit/11244/

But on the other hand, ya, you guys are paying for that shit, and then paying again for it down the road. You guys should be up in arms for what your government is doing. I should be too...

We do the same thing for prescription drugs - these companies operate in part on govt grants to research and develope drugs, then we pay the astronomical prices for the product when it comes to market for the ten years it takes for the patent to roll over (then generics can be made).

Finnster · 08.06.2009, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JThiessen

We do the same thing for prescription drugs - these companies operate in part on govt grants to research and develope drugs, then we pay the astronomical prices for the product when it comes to market for the ten years it takes for the patent to roll over (then generics can be made).

We give billions out via the NHS and other medical research for cancer and all sorts of things. Its how a lot of university labs and small companies exist. They do expensive and time-consuming research w/ no guaranteed outcomes. If and when they do have a winner, they are picked up by large pharmas and make tons of money.

Yes, the gov't is subsidizing research for private companies, but otoh its how a lot of this research gets done, and it employs high paid scientists doing work in the US, attracting talent from all over the world to our premere universities, and graduates often stay and work/form other small companies to continue the cycle. Its also why we have so much of the major pharmas (and their R&D jobs) here. We have the talent, we have the money, and companies locate in the US, creating US jobs, pay US taxes and own US based patents.
That is not even including all the surrounding lab support companies like Nalgene, GE, all the way to small lab equipment companies that all feed into the pharmas.

The flip side is to not fund it, watch all those jobs go somewhere else, and have korean or Euro companies own all the patents, and we pay billions overseas to buy our drugs, medical devices, etc. Don't get me wrong, its a global business, but we are on the top for a reason. Its not necc a parasitic relationship, but a symbiotic one. I'd rather pay higher taxes on a high-paying job than low taxes on no job.

Of all the dumb things the gov't spends $$ on, I am not quick to critize R&D funding.

JThiessen · 08.06.2009, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Finnster

Of all the dumb things the gov't spends $$ on, I am not quick to critize R&D funding.

Nor am I - I was only trying to equate this to existing systems.

Finnster · 08.06.2009, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JThiessen

Nor am I - I was only trying to equate this to existing systems.

I was agreeing with you and using your example as a good example ;) lol

We do pay a ton for the drugs tho..

08.06.2009, 08:35 PM

The Canadian government also gave the canadain divisions of GM & Chrylser bail out money.