I am wrong about MaxAmps.

[MetalMan]

Not to discredit Maxamps, but I think it might be difficult to successfully complete a test like that, since the pack Austin would send you might not necessarly be representative of other packs using the same cells that he sells.

[lincpimp]

Originally Posted by MetalMan

Not to discredit Maxamps, but I think it might be difficult to successfully complete a test like that, since the pack Austin would send you might not necessarly be representative of other packs using the same cells that he sells.

Do you think he would black shrink wrap a fp pack? That would be funny...

Out of the two guys, Austin is much easier to deal with then Jason. I never had any issues with him. Most of the packs I sent beack were thru Austin.

[Sammus]

Yeah I was thinking that, like when you see some dodgy takeaway shop claiming to win an award for the best pie or something, they just make one good one to give to the judge...

[aqwut]

after my debate with Jason, and calling me a Liar, I know what he's all about... and I don't care...
These were the packs that I had a few years ago... I decide to open them up, to see what cells they were.. Of course now, they have the manufacturer put MaxAmps on their cells...

[lutach]

Originally Posted by aqwut

after my debate with Jason, and calling me a Liar, I know what he's all about... and I don't care...
These were the packs that I had a few years ago... I decide to open them up, to see what cells they were.. Of course now, they have the manufacturer put MaxAmps on their cells...

aqwut,

They claim that pack is 20C? Man, they are in deep crap. I just noticed the part number and the 15HR means they are 15C here is the discharge graph for it http://www.tronicshz.com/down/839.jpg. I actually spoke with the owner of Tronics regarding their LiFePO4 batteries and he is a class act. This is what he said in the last e-mail, "Tronics is not a new company, we do the high rate Li-polymer from 2003, is the first one suppliers in China. Including Polyquest, MaxAmps, CheapestPoly, and other big fright offers, we have so many good cooperation in the world". Now correct me if I'm wrong, but Polyquest is made by Enerland which is one if not the best lipo manufacturer out there. I have attached the discharge graph of a 25C rated cell and in my opinion it is only good for 15C discharge.

[aqwut]

Originally Posted by lutach

aqwut,

They claim that pack is 20C? Man, they are in deep crap. I just noticed the part number and the 15HR means they are 15C here is the discharge graph for it http://www.tronicshz.com/down/839.jpg. I actually spoke with the owner of Tronics regarding their LiFePO4 batteries and he is a class act. This is what he said in the last e-mail, "Tronics is not a new company, we do the high rate Li-polymer from 2003, is the first one suppliers in China. Including Polyquest, MaxAmps, CheapestPoly, and other big fright offers, we have so many good cooperation in the world". Now correct me if I'm wrong, but Polyquest is made by Enerland which is one if not the best lipo manufacturer out there. I have attached the discharge graph of a 25C rated cell and in my opinion it is only good for 15C discharge.

I noticed that too lutach.....

[kulangflow]

I actually wanted to ask you guys for suggestions for making my testing better. It's pretty unscientific so far.

I like the fact that my tests are "real world" in an actual car on the ground, but that makes them hard to repeat pack to pack. I think I should do multiple runs per pack and test them within their first few cycles, then again like around 20 cycles like VintageMA suggested.

How long do you think I should run each test? I think that 10 minutes should be enough at 10 samples per second. How many times should I repeat each test per pack? An average of three sounds about right to me.

If Austin is willing to send me a pack for this, I definitely want to make the testing worthwhile. I'll probably take video of the testing as well so people can see the set-up and what-not.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

[lincpimp]

Run that pack till the lvc kicks in at 3v per cell. That way we can see what kind of capacity it has. Also some balancer info would be good. I would be interested to see how well the pack stays in balance during a full run. I had issues with my maxamps packs staying in balance during a run.

[kulangflow]

Originally Posted by lincpimp

Run that pack till the lvc kicks in at 3v per cell. That way we can see what kind of capacity it has. Also some balancer info would be good. I would be interested to see how well the pack stays in balance during a full run. I had issues with my maxamps packs staying in balance during a run.

How do you monitor balancing during a run? Do you mean to just check to see if it's still in balance after the run?

Man, that will take forever to test each pack all the way to LVC in my buggy, especially if I need to repeat the tests. I need something with a higher amp draw that I can run on 2s. I have a VXL Stampede, but it is light enough that it doesn't seem to draw much current. I could use my bl-Revo or stock E-maxx, but they'd be boring as crap on 2s.

Ideas?

[lincpimp]

Originally Posted by kulangflow

How do you monitor balancing during a run? Do you mean to just check to see if it's still in balance after the run?

Man, that will take forever to test each pack all the way to LVC in my buggy, especially if I need to repeat the tests. I need something with a higher amp draw that I can run on 2s. I have a VXL Stampede, but it is light enough that it doesn't seem to draw much current. I could use my bl-Revo or stock E-maxx, but they'd be boring as crap on 2s.

Ideas?

Just run it down to the lvc the first run and then after a dozen cycles. Would be interesting to see how the capacity changes after time.

Yeah, see if it is still in balance after the run, and then charge it at 1c and see if it can balance itself out during the charge. Alot of my packs needed charging at a lower rate, or filling up a bit, then blancing while off the charger, then charging again thru the balancer. It was a PITA, to say the least. My neuenergy, polyquest, fp, and polyrc do not need this, they will rarely go out of balance, and if they do it requires little balancing to get the right. I am a charger freak, check this out!

[johnrobholmes]

Lutach,

PQ is indeed enerland cells.

There are many unscrupulous sellers in china. At a Chinese trade show one of the employees of Novak went up to the hobbywing booth and had the HW rep tell him that they produced the ESC's for Novak. The novak employee then informed the HW rep who he was. Open mouth, insert foot. Novak does not have HW make ESCs for them.


I just may say something to one of my reps about this. He knew all along where MA was getting their cells, and had some interesting tibits about tronics last time we talked.

[lutach]

Originally Posted by johnrobholmes

Lutach,

PQ is indeed enerland cells.

There are many unscrupulous sellers in china. At a Chinese trade show one of the employees of Novak went up to the hobbywing booth and had the HW rep tell him that they produced the ESC's for Novak. The novak employee then informed the HW rep who he was. Open mouth, insert foot. Novak does not have HW make ESCs for them.


I just may say something to one of my reps about this. He knew all along where MA was getting their cells, and had some interesting tibits about tronics last time we talked.

HW is another case that is driving me nuts. They told me they couldn't send the 120A car controller here because of the relationship with Speed Passion. Now Venom and Orion will have their system branded. I told HW I would like a controller that had double the power board and a few changes of software so it would be completely different from SP, Venom and Orion. HW told me I needed to buy 2000 units a year, well I told HW I could buy 2000 units right away as I can cover Brasil with their product and no answer from HW. The Asians knows how to build stuff, but their business ethics has to change. The battery industry their is somewhat the same way. I contacted a few places asking for some samples and at first they all agree to send samples. But for some reason they tend to go the other way after I send them all my info.

[aqwut]

Originally Posted by johnrobholmes

Lutach,

PQ is indeed enerland cells.

There are many unscrupulous sellers in china. At a Chinese trade show one of the employees of Novak went up to the hobbywing booth and had the HW rep tell him that they produced the ESC's for Novak. The novak employee then informed the HW rep who he was. Open mouth, insert foot. Novak does not have HW make ESCs for them.


I just may say something to one of my reps about this. He knew all along where MA was getting their cells, and had some interesting tibits about tronics last time we talked.

What I would've paid to see the look on that guys face..

Lutach.. Business ethics in China, LOL... I don't think it'll ever change.. sell at ALL cost..

[lutach]

Originally Posted by aqwut

What I would've paid to see the look on that guys face..

Lutach.. Business ethics in China, LOL... I don't think it'll ever change.. sell at ALL cost..

They don't want to sell, that's the problem . All they told me to do is wait for the 1/8 scale controller, but I've heard Speed Passion will come out wit one as well and my guess is the HW will be making them for SP. All I can do is shoot for HV car controller and join the big club: Schulze, Kontronik, MGM and Actronic. Those are the only ones I know that makes HV 12S controllers and up.

[Finnster]

My thoughts on MA are this:

They are a dealer of "cheap" entry-level/basher packs, unfortunately they are not that cheap. They tend to consistanly overrate their product to stay competitive w/ other makers and justify inflated prices.

I remember when they were first starting out on Ebay selling GP3300 cells. They guaranteed 1.21v/cell@30A (IIRC) on unmatched and untested cells. They had a money back guarantee if the cells if they could not do this.

Question is, how can they make that claim? The cells were never tested! They were sold right out the box. Well, because people don't have a $600 CE discharger to test them and prove they are not what they say they are. People (n00bs) see those cells guaranteed, and then see tested and matched cells going for much more. Why pay $75 for a matched racing pack that does maybe 1.18V, when you can buy a ~$30 pack that is guaranteed to do 1.21V? Where were they getting all these magical GP cells that did huge voltages, and that were so reliable they didn't even have to test them to be sure? Meanwhile all the other batt makers had to screen and match cells to find the very rare few that could do such high voltages... talk about overhead... Meanwhile those buyers prolly only ever owned crappy powerizer packs or such, and the difference was so big few questioned the claim.

Its complete BS, and most should know it, but they sold tons of packs. Now the price they were charging for a normal sxs 6cell GP3300 wasn't hugely expensive, but it was several $$ more than other makers just selling (the same) plain jane 6cell GP packs. I call it the MaxAmps Bull$%it Mark-up Factor, and frankly its been very successful for them and they've grown tremendously.

I don't think their products are necc horrible. They are just not that good, and expensive for what they are. They are roughly the same quality as several TrueRC packs but with an easier form factor, regardless of actual manufacturer. TrueRC doesn't overhype their cells (you know what you are getting), their website is fairly crappy, but they are fairly-priced and honest in what they sell.
I have, and will continue to buy my cheap packs from TRC, and if I want better cells I will buy Neus. The price is not that far off MA's, but they are considerably higher quality and performance.
Caveat emptor, bitches. [/Chappelle]