Has Castle Abandoned us on Warranty

[E-Revonut]

Originally Posted by BrianG

Well, you gotta use some common sense. It would be like putting the MMM as the powerplant in a Prius and complaining the motor and/or ESC blew. You have to use it in the right application. Using it with a tiny ~50mm motor in a heavy 8th scale application geared for any decent speed is asking for trouble.

And it would be hard to simply put a list of "acceptable motors" because even those can be the wrong motor depending on the application. Even the bundled CC/Neu motors could be too much for the ESC if used incorrectly. Just too many factors to make a hard rule.

It simply sounds like they are diplomatically saying "Don't expect us to be accountable for your idiocy".

Very well put!!!

A month ago I bought a MMM 2200kv combo, and I'll run it on 6S.

Is my warranty gone if I run that setup on 6S?

[JThiessen]

Originally Posted by Semi Pro

your right, but castle keep telling us that they are bullet proof and that the v3's arent failing, then they say that if you use a smaller motor, you lose your warrenty

something doesnt add up.

Smaller motor ON GREATER THAN 4S.....Gotta remember that guys.
If you dont know if your motor falls under the description, go find out (personal responsibility here....)

[BrianG]

Originally Posted by JThiessen

Smaller motor ON GREATER THAN 4S.....

I understand where they are coming from, but even that rule makes no sense though. Even 6s on a Neu 1506/6d would be fine in a smaller vehicle. So, it's not a matter of voltage on a motor per se, it's more about choosing the motor size to match the vehicle size AND choosing a kv to match the battery voltage. Unfortunately, that seems to be too complex for some people...

The tool I am currently making for Mike will (hopefully) address these issues. It uses a totally different algorithm for determining motor suitability than my current motor selector page. Trying to make it as idiot proof for the noobs as possible yet make it detailed enough to satisy the curiosity of the more experienced hobbyist is a bit difficult though.

[Joe Ford]

Originally Posted by BrianG

I understand where they are coming from, but even that rule makes no sense though. Even 6s on a Neu 1506/6d would be fine in a smaller vehicle. So, it's not a matter of voltage on a motor per se, it's more about choosing the motor size to match the vehicle size AND choosing a kv to match the battery voltage. Unfortunately, that seems to be too complex for some people...

The tool I am currently making for Mike will (hopefully) address these issues. It uses a totally different algorithm for determining motor suitability than my current motor selector page. Trying to make it as idiot proof for the noobs as possible yet make it detailed enough to satisy the curiosity of the more experienced hobbyist is a bit difficult though.

You're 100% right...so to make it as idiotproof as possible we state what we know works, and expect customers to abide by it, or pay the penalty if something happens. There would be too many guys trying to run a 540 size 5000kv motor on 6s lipo and expecting us to warranty the setup. Not going to happen.

A motor that is too small for the application will overheat. These guidelines are for your safety, our customers...not just us trying to be jerks or screw anyone. We expect you to use either our motor or it's EQUIVALENT in these applications, at the same voltage that you would run our motor at. Use what we recommend and you won't have a problem. Use a motor that is the same size as ours and you won't have an issue. Use the proper voltage and you don't. Proper gearing, same thing. It's only when you do not run a proper setup (and we've tested WAY more than anyone else to find out what is proper and what is not) that you void the warranty. Don't know how many ESCs and motors I turned into paperweights in testing, but we used that testing as guidelines for our customers setups. Our recommendations are always what we KNOW works.

[Unsullied_Spy]

Originally Posted by Joe Ford

You're 100% right...so to make it as idiotproof as possible we state what we know works, and expect customers to abide by it, or pay the penalty if something happens. There would be too many guys trying to run a 540 size 5000kv motor on 6s lipo and expecting us to warranty the setup. Not going to happen.

A motor that is too small for the application will overheat. When that happens the magnets in the motor lose some of the magnetic properties, and the motor spins faster. Every time you do this the motor will keep increasing speed...until it flies apart. The motor will come to an IMMEDIATE stop and amp draw goes through the roof, and the ESC and possibly batteries fail. These guidelines are for your safety, our customers...not just us trying to be jerks or screw anyone. We are very clear about our warranty. Use what we recommend and you won't have a problem. Use a motor that is the same size as ours and you won't have an issue. Use the proper voltage and you don't. Proper gearing, same thing. It's only when you do not run a proper setup (and we've tested WAY more than anyone else to find out what is proper and what is not) that you void the warranty. Don't know how many ESCs and motors I turned into paperweights in testing, but we used that testing as guidelines for our customers setups. Our recommendations are always what we KNOW works.

I mentioned earlier that I could be getting a 1300 or 1500 KV MedUsa 50mm motor and running it on 6s in a CRT .5 with a MMM. This wouldn't void the warranty because the motor is well-suited for the application, correct?

Originally Posted by BrianG

It simply sounds like they are diplomatically saying "Don't expect us to be accountable for your idiocy".

Sounds good to me, is it true?

[BrianG]

I understand where you guys are coming from Joe. But you know that no matter how idiot-proof you make something, they'll just make a better idiot.

Maybe you should incorporate some type of explosive material in the ESC and/or motor. That way, when either blows, it takes out the user. Darwin at work.

[Unsullied_Spy]

Originally Posted by BrianG

Maybe you should incorporate some type of explosive material in the ESC and/or motor. That way, when either blows, it takes out the user. Darwin at work.

That would take out the people running MMs in Buggies, Truggies, and MTs, that's for sure.

[BrianG]

Yes, that's true. Luckily I don't run a MM in anything larger than 1/10 scale 2WD or 1/12 scale 4WD.

On second thought, that would be bad for the economy because the CC support department would be so bored that CC would have to lay them off. No need to increase the already increasing unemployment rate. Oh well, it was a thought...

[hoovhartid]

Originally Posted by BrianG

no matter how idiot-proof you make something, they'll just make a better idiot.

This is true.....

[slimthelineman]

maybee i missed something in the last three pages but why would you use the MMM with a 50mm motor in an 1/8 scale when castle sells it with waaaaayyyyyy bigger motors. the whole idea with this controller was to have sick power on tap. If the manufacturer says not to do something, dont do it. i have been through.... uuhhhh.... a few v2's and v3's(which were due to the case popping open during a race) and castle has been TOO nice to me through all of it and honored the warranty on all of them. 6s is alot of power to push, if the motor cant take it your speedo may go with it. you wouldnt hook up a 12kv primary phase to a meter panel right? it takes some thought to not use a MMM combo, but it will pay off with grins in the end. when i race most people are smiling bigger than me when i silently pass the nitros. anyways the castle guys are good at what they do, follow their recomendations and all will go well.

Originally Posted by Byte

A month ago I bought a MMM 2200kv combo, and I'll run it on 6S.

Is my warranty gone if I run that setup on 6S?

Could someone answer this question?

[Arct1k]

No! Castle advertise as such for both motors!

http://www.castlecreations.com/produ...a_monster.html


Product Max Input Volts Amp Rating* Weight Retail Price
Mamba Monster with Neu-Castle 2200kv Motor 25.2 120 121g $349.00
Mamba Monster with Neu-Castle 2650kv Motor 25.2 120 121g $349.00
*Full throttle continuous operation with cooling airflow

[mkrusedc]

Originally Posted by BrianG

I understand where you guys are coming from Joe. But you know that no matter how idiot-proof you make something, they'll just make a better idiot.

Maybe you should incorporate some type of explosive material in the ESC and/or motor. That way, when either blows, it takes out the user. Darwin at work.

That is just so funny

[Pdelcast]

I think we are all missing something here....


A Warranty covers an item against manufacturing defects.

So, if we built a Mamba Monster that had a bad MOSFET on board, and that FET blew during normal use, we will cover the Mamba Monster under warranty.

Tech support gives recommendations of what they know works. If you venture far outside of that realm, they will tell you that failures will probably be considered an "Overcurrent" or "abuse" failure -- which wouldn't be covered under warranty.

All warranties work this way. If you blow your clutch on your Toyota Corolla while street racing, Toyota isn't going to cover it under warranty. If you don't change the oil in your Toyota, they aren't going to cover that either.

A Warranty is to cover a consumer in the case that they get a defective component from a manufacturer. There is always some small number of pieces/parts manufactured that have an issue - -so the warranty there is to protect the consumer against defects of manufacturing.

A Warranty does not cover neglect (you get grass in your transmission and it eats up the gears, bad bearings in the wheels which you don't replace, you get dirt all crammed up in your ESC... etc)

A Warranty does not cover abuse (you use a 5500Kv motor with 6S, you run a setup that draws 2000A during acceleration, you try to run a 1/5th scale 4wd buggy with a Mamba Monster, you smash your Mamba Monster with a hammer, etc....)

A Warranty does not cover stupidity (you try to run a Monster with 8S Lipo, you jump your car over your house, you run over your 1/8th scale buggy with your 1:1 scale SUV, etc...)

SO -- what your warranty covers is defective Mamba Monsters.

If you want to experiment -- go ahead. Just don't be too surprised that if you damage your Mamba Monster from over current, that it won't be covered.

If you are careful, you shouldn't have any problems. If you do have a problem, we have a non-warranty replacement policy.

Under the non-warranty replacement policy, we will cover EVERYTHING. (Including hitting your Mamba Monster with a hammer.) The non-warranty replacement is only $70.00 -- so if $70.00 doesn't seem like a hefty penalty for doing whatever you want with your Mamba Monster... GO FOR IT!


If $70.00 to cover abuse seems excessive -- then you can take the advice of Tech Support (remember -- they can only comment on what they have tried -- so anything outside of what they personally have used will get the same "That might be outside your warranty coverage" answer...) and only try things that we have personally tried here at Castle, and know work well.

WE WILL ALWAYS cover (under warranty) any Castle controller that has a warranty issue -- if the controller damage is caused by a defect in a component in the controller, or a defect caused during manufacturing.


Thank you for listening to me rant!!!!

Patrick